Honda RCV1000R

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

Kropotkin

3646811382318836

You fuckers had better be nice to the insider. He clearly knows his ..... If you want him to stick around, knock it back a notch.

And no, I don't know who it is.

Morning David, I am really looking forward to chatting with you on here, have you seen the production racer yet? is the word in the pit similar to what I am saying? or is the corporate door closed?

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

Geonerd

3646871382320885

Sure you haven't taken a page from Jumkie's playbook and created an alter-ego or three?

As funny as that would be, no he has not, not in my case anyway.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

mylexicon

3646931382323709

Hello, the-insider

I hope you are enjoying your gang beat-in. Your info seems legit, but the x-factor is the spec-software on the open-class (huh?) ECU. If the GPC want to hobble the open-class 24L bikes, it is as easy as telling the crank sensor not to let the engine exceed a certain speed. Yes?

I have not had such a warm welcome in years,. The software package for the production bike will do exactly what is needed for this bike to perform as required, as Stoners test has already proved, You cannot change one sensor and get the result you are saying, changes have to be made in many areas to get an over all change. I try not to get involved on the electronics side, I do understand their systems to a degree, but it not my area at all.

BarryMachine · Oct 21, 2013

Can Ducati buy some of these RCV's?

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

Austin

3646901382322058

Sure, I get the appeal of joint development, but where do you start when the potential partners aren't on the same level? Suzuki presumably has poured considerable money into its MotoGP program ahead of their expected return; to my knowledge' that hasn't happened at Kawasaki. Just seems like an awful lot of R&D to hand over to an eventual rival unless Kawasaki has been doing some behind-closed-doors development.

KHI always have something under development, but it will never be seen unless they intend to race it in the near future, KHI have not shared data to my knowledge regarding Suzuki's current project, I said a partnership was discussed, Suzuki's bike looks to be good, but it is a long way off, the RCV1000R seems to be miles ahead, and that is a production bike.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

kiddyK

3646971382326568

Did you read it?

Not at all like the charge you made. So a customer bike has a little less power than the full-house HRC factory bike and because of different ECU software and no fancy gearbox, has a different feeling in engine braking.

If I were you, I would have concentrated on "high average speeds worthy of the RC213V" and "within a few tenths of his time on the factory bike".

I am pleased you read that as it was written, the clues to what is coming are there for all to read. good find buddy.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

BarryMachine

3647401382343297

Can Ducati buy some of these RCV's?

That has put a smile on my face that will last all day, brilliant.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

kiddyK

3646961382326143

You may be able to clear something up - HRC have stated they are making five bikes. So that is to equip two riders and a spare for wildcards? If that's the case, then Aspar are going to be the only team with a bike, or are they only doling out one per rider?

I don't know how many bikes they have built, but I think it will be more than five, it is far cheaper to more now than more later, there will also be many frames and swing arms in a pile somewhere. best guess is possibly 10 complete bikes and 4 frames per bike.

kiddyK · Oct 21, 2013

That's what I suspected. When Nakamoto said '5 bikes' I was thinking 5 sets of bikes, two for Aspar, one for Gresini, one for LCR/PBM(?), one for Cardion. That would seem the likely mix. Can't see Ioda and Blusens changing. Can't see Cardion sticking with Ducati, if the chance at a fast customer (and ultimately resellable) bike is available.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

kiddyK

3647771382352636

That's what I suspected. When Nakamoto said '5 bikes' I was thinking 5 sets of bikes, two for Aspar, one for Gresini, one for LCR/PBM(?), one for Cardion. That would seem the likely mix. Can't see Ioda and Blusens changing. Can't see Cardion sticking with Ducati, if the chance at a fast customer (and ultimately resellable) bike is available.

Agreed, they are not cheap, but they are going to be in a different league to the Desmo, I don't know what the lease deal is for the Desmo is, but I bet its around the 1mill mark, Some are saying you will be able to have a Desmo with spec electronics and extra fuel next year, I see no sense in this at all.

Keshav · Oct 21, 2013

kiddyK

3647041382327660

He looks like he plays banjo and shouts 'sooowweeeeeee'. If you replaced the B'stones cap with John Deere...

Well.. comes down to it - tho I'm born and bred in NY, NY the city so nice they named it twice

- I'm always up for some Earl and Scruggs, and never turned down extra bacon on my burger. B)

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

Keshav

3648321382378270

Well.. comes down to it - tho I'm born and bred in NY, NY the city so nice they named it twice

- I'm always up for some Earl and Scruggs, and never turned down extra bacon on my burger. B)

Off topic, but how did you get involved in Indian music?

Keshav · Oct 21, 2013

the-insider

3648341382378553

Off topic, but how did you get involved in Indian music?

In a nutshell.

Been playing guitar (and a little banjo) since I was knee-high to a flat-pick.

Started club-racing at a very late age and collected a good many injuries (broken back, broken collar bones, wrist fractures, broken hip etc)

Began doing yoga after I quit racing 'cause I needed something to keep me in shape so I wouldn't end up walking around like a cripple and

met a singer named Krishnadas at my yoga center and ended up touring with him in the States and India. Nobody around in the USA other

than one shop in California was selling quality instruments. I figure they could stand a bit of competition so I quit my day job after 22 years

and started my own business.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

Thanks buddy, may it continue to prosper.

hawkdriver · Oct 21, 2013

kiddyK

3646971382326568

Did you read it?

Not at all like the charge you made. So a customer bike has a little less power than the full-house HRC factory bike and because of different ECU software and no fancy gearbox, has a different feeling in engine braking.

If I were you, I would have concentrated on "high average speeds worthy of the RC213V" and "within a few tenths of his time on the factory bike".

I wonder why his times on the factory bike weren't posted? Casey is an incredibly talented rider, but I seriously doubt he can match the times that Pedrosa and Mark could put up on the current RCV. He had one day with the bike and no time was released so it doesn't matter if he was close with the production bike. Being down one ltr of fuel isn't going to kill the factory bikes next year or bring this production racer closer to their times.

It's about getting the power down with electronics and doing it as efficiently as possible. Full open throttle is a bit over rated in these bikes as Yamaha have proven, and now Honda is showing them the way, braking and acceleration. Besides telling us about a joint venture and Nicky getting a podium finish(still laughable) what have you told us, not much, except about your hurt feelings.

Will the production bikes be updated during the season? I seriously doubt it, at one point HRC had DP and CS on different frames. I doubt the production bike and it's riders get that level of service and support. You say the pneumatic valves don't matter and the production racer will be able to make more power for longer because it will have more fuel. That's nice, now go and look at some engine dyno's of those two valve systems and tell me which one you'd rather have on a track after comparing their power bands. It isn't just a rev limit that makes one better than the other.

Has the bike even been tested with the ECU it's going to be running next year or has it been using the HRC ECU?

I would have responded sooner, but I honestly thought you left after saying you were going to twice.

the-insider · Oct 21, 2013

hawkdriver

3648921382397302

I wonder why his times on the factory bike weren't posted? Casey is an incredibly talented rider, but I seriously doubt he can match the times that Pedrosa and Mark could put up on the current RCV. He had one day with the bike and no time was released so it doesn't matter if he was close with the production bike. Being down one ltr of fuel isn't going to kill the factory bikes next year or bring this production racer closer to their times.

It's about getting the power down with electronics and doing it as efficiently as possible. Full open throttle is a bit over rated in these bikes as Yamaha have proven, and now Honda is showing them the way, braking and acceleration. Besides telling us about a joint venture and Nicky getting a podium finish(still laughable) what have you told us, not much, except about your hurt feelings.

Will the production bikes be updated during the season? I seriously doubt it, at one point HRC had DP and CS on different frames. I doubt the production bike and it's riders get that level of service and support. You say the pneumatic valves don't matter and the production racer will be able to make more power for longer because it will have more fuel. That's nice, now go and look at some engine dyno's of those two valve systems and tell me which one you'd rather have on a track after comparing their power bands. It isn't just a rev limit that makes one better than the other.

Has the bike even been tested with the ECU it's going to be running next year or has it been using the HRC ECU?

I would have responded sooner, but I honestly thought you left after saying you were going to twice.

Just read all of your post, I don't care what you think, or think you know, I actually look at Dyno readings for a living, I fully understand the power and torque curves required, unlike you and your "power bands". Two valve systems? you have lost me there. The one Ltr drop is massive, as anyone with the remotest clue is aware of, so we will count you out of that one as well. If you had paid any attention this year you would be fully aware, as the rest of the civilised world is, that Yamaha are right on the fuel limit, next year is going to be very tough for them. If you had read the whole thread you would have discovered that it has been tested with the spec ECU, but as you only wanted to have a dig, you missed the best bits. Now pay attention, the production bike will be as near as damn it a 2013 RCV with 4Ltrs of extra fuel, that is a very dig deal. But as you obviously know better that HRC or Casey I will wait for your educated reply with great anticipation. As for you not replying sooner, it made no difference, you added nothing of any note, so don't worry yourself.

hawkdriver · Oct 21, 2013

<span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;This is a competitive machine even when compared directly to the full factory prototypes

We'll see how this goes for you, the only thing you have to go on is fuel or at least it's the only thing you're going on about. Honda doesn't get the rules changed because it isn't ready.

When I said two valve systems I was referring to conventional vs pneumatic, and if you look at dyno graphs for a living you must know that higher revs are not the only advantages to pneumatic valves. I'll be right here for the post season test and watching in anticipation at the production racer that is competitive with full factory prototypes, and I'll be here all season waiting on Nicky to get his 29th podium finish thanks to the production racer.

L8Braker · Oct 21, 2013

insider, I guess Valencia will tell all. As of now the only healthy guys testing will be Nicky, and possibly Hiroshi Aoyama??? Don't expect much, but should be interesting nonetheless. There will definitely be a bunch of eyes on it as it circulates the track.

kiddyK · Oct 21, 2013

hawkdriver

3648921382397302

I wonder why his times on the factory bike weren't posted? Casey is an incredibly talented rider, but I seriously doubt he can match the times that Pedrosa and Mark could put up on the current RCV. He had one day with the bike and no time was released so it doesn't matter if he was close with the production bike. Being down one ltr of fuel isn't going to kill the factory bikes next year or bring this production racer closer to their times.

It's about getting the power down with electronics and doing it as efficiently as possible. Full open throttle is a bit over rated in these bikes as Yamaha have proven, and now Honda is showing them the way, braking and acceleration. Besides telling us about a joint venture and Nicky getting a podium finish(still laughable) what have you told us, not much, except about your hurt feelings.

Will the production bikes be updated during the season? I seriously doubt it, at one point HRC had DP and CS on different frames. I doubt the production bike and it's riders get that level of service and support. You say the pneumatic valves don't matter and the production racer will be able to make more power for longer because it will have more fuel. That's nice, now go and look at some engine dyno's of those two valve systems and tell me which one you'd rather have on a track after comparing their power bands. It isn't just a rev limit that makes one better than the other.

Has the bike even been tested with the ECU it's going to be running next year or has it been using the HRC ECU?

I would have responded sooner, but I honestly thought you left after saying you were going to twice.

I didn't tell you ...., you got The Wrong Man's.

Seems like accuracy isn't a strong point with you.

Sloth_27 · Oct 21, 2013

Is the reason HRC are putting so much development effort into this Production Racer because beyond 2015 - this will be the premier class and the current prototypes will be gone? Because that is the way I see this developing and HRC may be using this bike as a head start for the time when we have the spec ECU as the only option.

Honda RCV1000R

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