Honda RCV1000R
- Thread starter the-insider
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the-insider
I see how you think that, but your analogy makes it sound far more serious than it is. Also, I would add you are wrong in this case. I used to get very disgruntled with some of the banter on here, called some names etc, but came to realize that it's not nearly as serious as it looks when written. Smile as you type, smile as you read, say what you want. Everyone wins. If I wrote a transcript of the banter I have with my friends in the office it would sound much much worse than anything you read on here.
I see how you think that, but your analogy makes it sound far more serious than it is. Also, I would add you are wrong in this case. I used to get very disgruntled with some of the banter on here, called some names etc, but came to realize that it's not nearly as serious as it looks when written. Smile as you type, smile as you read, say what you want. Everyone wins. If I wrote a transcript of the banter I have with my friends in the office it would sound much much worse than anything you read on here.
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Tom
Good points Tom, and very well put, I will try to do as you suggest.
Good points Tom, and very well put, I will try to do as you suggest.
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Mick D
I don't need to make any form of comeback in you case Mick, I work in an environment that gives me a great deal of insight into what is actually happening in certain areas of Moto gp, I offered some of this up for debate but you chose to play the personal card, we have had our little jolly, so contributions from you will mean very little at best.
I don't need to make any form of comeback in you case Mick, I work in an environment that gives me a great deal of insight into what is actually happening in certain areas of Moto gp, I offered some of this up for debate but you chose to play the personal card, we have had our little jolly, so contributions from you will mean very little at best.
Austin
Dr. Gonzo
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the-insider
No, they're not. That's why I have a hard time believing their €1.2-million customer bike will be any closer than a half second to the full-factory machine. Unless, of course, Honda believe that this formula is the direction MotoGP is headed and are getting a head start—even then, I'd think they'd install a handicap to ensure the Repsols remain the fastest Hondas.
Perhaps, as you say, that gap could shrink once more data becomes available for the Showa kit, but won't teams running these bikes be given the data collected by Bautista over the past two years? If that's the case, surely there isn't a lot of room for improvement there.
No, they're not. That's why I have a hard time believing their €1.2-million customer bike will be any closer than a half second to the full-factory machine. Unless, of course, Honda believe that this formula is the direction MotoGP is headed and are getting a head start—even then, I'd think they'd install a handicap to ensure the Repsols remain the fastest Hondas.
Perhaps, as you say, that gap could shrink once more data becomes available for the Showa kit, but won't teams running these bikes be given the data collected by Bautista over the past two years? If that's the case, surely there isn't a lot of room for improvement there.
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the-insider
0.8 seconds, while nothing to be sneezed at, is still a relatively large margin. Espagaro has occasionally had the ART within that range, and he's never finished better than 8th in a race. While it's easy to say the gap can come down with refinement to the package--I'd imagine Stoner did have some set-up and suspension data to work with, btw--the times Stoner set on the next year's factory bike can and will also get faster.
I can't see Hayden putting the bike on the podium next year, unless Yamaha and Ducati are hopelessly compromised by the 20L limit and Bradl and Bautista fail to finish. If the RCv1000r turns out to be better than Honda's satellite machinery, what exactly are Gresini and LCR being subsidised by Dorna/paying for? It would be embarrassing for Honda if Fausto handed back the satellite bike, pointed to Redding's and said: "We'll have two of those."
0.8 seconds, while nothing to be sneezed at, is still a relatively large margin. Espagaro has occasionally had the ART within that range, and he's never finished better than 8th in a race. While it's easy to say the gap can come down with refinement to the package--I'd imagine Stoner did have some set-up and suspension data to work with, btw--the times Stoner set on the next year's factory bike can and will also get faster.
I can't see Hayden putting the bike on the podium next year, unless Yamaha and Ducati are hopelessly compromised by the 20L limit and Bradl and Bautista fail to finish. If the RCv1000r turns out to be better than Honda's satellite machinery, what exactly are Gresini and LCR being subsidised by Dorna/paying for? It would be embarrassing for Honda if Fausto handed back the satellite bike, pointed to Redding's and said: "We'll have two of those."
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Austin
Hi Austin, firstly you are correct in your assumption, this what Honda are up to, as I stated earlier, KHI and Suzuki discussed doing this as a joint venture, just as they did with MX years ago.
When the production bike was tested it did not have the latest gen Showa's that Alvaro is now using, there is much more to come, but you can buy full A spec Ohlins for this bike and have access to the Repsol team data.
Hi Austin, firstly you are correct in your assumption, this what Honda are up to, as I stated earlier, KHI and Suzuki discussed doing this as a joint venture, just as they did with MX years ago.
When the production bike was tested it did not have the latest gen Showa's that Alvaro is now using, there is much more to come, but you can buy full A spec Ohlins for this bike and have access to the Repsol team data.
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Rising Sun
The bike is already much better than when tested by Stoner, it will be very much better by the first race of next season.
All of the factory teams are going to be compromised by the 20ltr rule, including Honda.
The bike is already much better than when tested by Stoner, it will be very much better by the first race of next season.
All of the factory teams are going to be compromised by the 20ltr rule, including Honda.
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Keshav
Thank you Keshav, I may be way off here, but are you in New York,? and involved in Indian music?
Thank you Keshav, I may be way off here, but are you in New York,? and involved in Indian music?
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Excellent, I have a buddy who also works for KHI, he plays some form of violin/banjo cross with only one string, I believe he bought some music from Keshav, I will ask him next week.
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the-insider
Aren't there rumours to the effect that Honda can basically run with 20L right now?
Aren't there rumours to the effect that Honda can basically run with 20L right now?
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Rising Sun
Yes, this is why it will be very good, it is already in satellite territory with the 20ltr rule, and this is how it has been developed. With and extra 4ltrs it will produce full power for longer.
Yes, this is why it will be very good, it is already in satellite territory with the 20ltr rule, and this is how it has been developed. With and extra 4ltrs it will produce full power for longer.
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the-insider
I was actually referring to the current 2013 factory bikes (hence Honda won't be compromised), but I'm not sure if you are. Re: development, I'm not really across all the technical stuff, but why would you develop a bike for 20L... and then add 4L? Shouldn't you just develop it as a 24L bike from the beginning, since the extra weight, etc. would make it handle differently. Of course, I imagine the only time a bike would be fully fuelled in any case would be during race simulations and testing performance for the early laps of a race.
If this bike is as good as you say it is, will Espargaro be kicking himself for buying out/getting out of his contract with Aspar? Any news on who will ride with Hayden? (Aspar is taking 2 bikes, correct?) With Redding on one, and Abraham on another, I imagine no.5 will soon be snapped up. Can PBM afford it?
I was actually referring to the current 2013 factory bikes (hence Honda won't be compromised), but I'm not sure if you are. Re: development, I'm not really across all the technical stuff, but why would you develop a bike for 20L... and then add 4L? Shouldn't you just develop it as a 24L bike from the beginning, since the extra weight, etc. would make it handle differently. Of course, I imagine the only time a bike would be fully fuelled in any case would be during race simulations and testing performance for the early laps of a race.
If this bike is as good as you say it is, will Espargaro be kicking himself for buying out/getting out of his contract with Aspar? Any news on who will ride with Hayden? (Aspar is taking 2 bikes, correct?) With Redding on one, and Abraham on another, I imagine no.5 will soon be snapped up. Can PBM afford it?
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Rising Sun
I see what you mean, all the factory bikes can finish with the current amount of fuel, but they cannot produce full power for the whole race, next year they loose 1ltr, so will producing full power for lees time, Honda will suffer less than Yamaha, as Yamaha are struggling more at the moment, the production bike was developed to work with next years rules, so having more fuel will allow it to produce full power for longer,
As for the Yamaha of Espargaro, they are getting frames and engines, everything else will be made by the team (but that may change), Yamaha have no experience with the new fuel rule, for this bike, they also have not developed this bike for the spec ecu, Honda have, I believe it will take a long time to get the customer Yamaha up to speed.
Can Paul afford a production Honda? loose change to that guy.
I see what you mean, all the factory bikes can finish with the current amount of fuel, but they cannot produce full power for the whole race, next year they loose 1ltr, so will producing full power for lees time, Honda will suffer less than Yamaha, as Yamaha are struggling more at the moment, the production bike was developed to work with next years rules, so having more fuel will allow it to produce full power for longer,
As for the Yamaha of Espargaro, they are getting frames and engines, everything else will be made by the team (but that may change), Yamaha have no experience with the new fuel rule, for this bike, they also have not developed this bike for the spec ecu, Honda have, I believe it will take a long time to get the customer Yamaha up to speed.
Can Paul afford a production Honda? loose change to that guy.
Austin
Dr. Gonzo
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the-insider
Very interesting that this is the direction in development in Japan. Maybe this is the MSMA's grand plan to increase competition and grid sizes without giving up power.
I'd wondered about the availability of Öhlins on that bike. I'd expect that will be the route taken for most private teams, no?
Very interesting that this is the direction in development in Japan. Maybe this is the MSMA's grand plan to increase competition and grid sizes without giving up power.
I'd wondered about the availability of Öhlins on that bike. I'd expect that will be the route taken for most private teams, no?
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Austin
Ohlins and Brembo's, unless Herv is in charge, then you have to buy your own lol
Ohlins and Brembo's, unless Herv is in charge, then you have to buy your own lol
