Going off track

Lots of noise about Martin and his penalty.

May I remind you the very core principle of closed circuit racing is to stay on track to be qualified for a result.
To improve the show the rules have been relaxed, the gravel areas have been replaced with solid tarmac. However, in my view there should remain at least some penalty for going off. Right now some folks think visiting nearby villages does not disqualify the racer? As the camel story goes, if it gets its nose under tent ... What I see here is the camel coming into tent.

Disclaimer: As always, I post my views to be considered by members, not necessarily to be agreed with. Everyone, please form your own.

I'm right there with you about off-track excursions. We don't need riders getting hurt, but without limits it isn't a sport. I admit I haven't read the rules recently, maybe I'm behind. My impression was that a rider could not gain an advantage from cutting a chicane - Martin yielded the position to Bagnaia, no advantage gained.

My biggest gripe is that it creates a situation where a rider does go off track, they might as well pin it and take all the advantage they can. If you're going to get a long lap either way, you might as well take everything you can get once you've gone over the line.

techDmn said:

I'm right there with you about off-track excursions. We don't need riders getting hurt, but without limits it isn't a sport. I admit I haven't read the rules recently, maybe I'm behind. My impression was that a rider could not gain an advantage from cutting a chicane - Martin yielded the position to Bagnaia, no advantage gained.

My biggest gripe is that it creates a situation where a rider does go off track, they might as well pin it and take all the advantage they can. If you're going to get a long lap either way, you might as well take everything you can get once you've gone over the line.

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The rule is that if they go off track, they need to lose one second in that sector (or the next one depending on where the sector finishes I believe). So, there should be no motivation to pin it and take whatever advantage they can. Quite the opposite. Martin received the penality because he didn't lose a second.

(More generally for the thread)

I also agree completely with the OP. There needs to be enough penality to encourage riders to stay on track. And, those penalities need to be correctly and consistently applied, even if a transgressor is in the title battle.

It was, to my mind, a bit amusing how many Moto3 riders had penalties for tooling around slowly in qualifying. Hopefully the message will be getting through.

The older rules of not gaining an advantage by going off track were probably outdated when the newer rules come in. Realistically, a LLP or losing a second over the sector is a better result for both the rider and for our entertainment than if there was gravel in the same position.

How does a rider determine if he's lost the 1 second he is mandated to lose? Given the fine margins, there is a big difference between losing 1 second and 1.2 seconds. How does a rider manage this? I believe they have lap timers on their dash? Even so, can they monitor them in real-time to adjust for that 1 second?

If other riders are around, then a rider who has gone off track should be aware of what half a second behind or one second behind, or two seconds behind looks like. Even if there aren't other riders, I would think that the best riders in the world can make a reasonable guess as to how much time they lose through (e.g.) rolling off a bit. If they need to lose 1.3 seconds to be sure that they've lost 1.0 seconds, I don't see a problem with that.

Exactly AT. Glad to see others feel the same way and have an 'old school' mentality.

It's rather simple, Martin could have easily made SURE he lost a second, and dropped behind Marquez. He would have easily repassed him and not had the penalty. Instead he took a gamble that he lost a second, and he didn't.

I do laugh at how they try and skirmish the rules, then moan when they are penalised to said rule.

In NASCAR they have to come to a complete stop if they cut a chicane so losing one second is quite a humane penalty.

What is annoying is the penalties for running wide. They found a solution for that in F1 by putting small strips of gravel on the outside of the last two turns but they removed them for the MotoGP race.

They could add the time penalty to the finish time, something they use to do, I recall Rossi getting a 10 second penalty for overtaking on a yellow flag at PI and still winning

mikesbytes said:

They could add the time penalty to the finish time, something they use to do, I recall Rossi getting a 10 second penalty for overtaking on a yellow flag at PI and still winning

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I prefer the long lap penalty, as it becomes part of the race. And, then you don't get riders staying just behind another rider because the following rider knows that the leading rider has a penality. I don't like it when I see a race finish, and then the results are different. There's no way to prevent that, e.g. track limit violations on the last lap, but it's good if such can be minimised. Overall: I prefer the done and finished nature of the long lap. And, there is skill involved in taking the penality with the minimum amount of time lost, while still completing the penality properly and not having to do it again. E.g. Zarco taking a very early long lap penalty and losing little time.

AnnoyingTwit said:

I prefer the long lap penalty, as it becomes part of the race. And, then you don't get riders staying just behind another rider because the following rider knows that the leading rider has a penality. I don't like it when I see a race finish, and then the results are different. There's no way to prevent that, e.g. track limit violations on the last lap, but it's good if such can be minimised. Overall: I prefer the done and finished nature of the long lap. And, there is skill involved in taking the penality with the minimum amount of time lost, while still completing the penality properly and not having to do it again. E.g. Zarco taking a very early long lap penalty and losing little time.

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Do you think a long lap penalty rather than having to drop one second? BTY the introduction of a long lap penalty instead of doing a pit lane ride thru for minor infringements was a great improvement

mikesbytes said:

Do you think a long lap penalty rather than having to drop one second? BTY the introduction of a long lap penalty instead of doing a pit lane ride thru for minor infringements was a great improvement

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I believe that both can be used. I may have misunderstood your post. Sorry if that is the case. But, I prefer long lap penalties and dropping a second than adding time on at the end changing the order.