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2004
Best season of all time .... ?
- Thread starter BarryMachine
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Good stuff, thanks. I figured if it had happened, it would have been in the era of Lawson, Rainy, Spencer, Doohan,Schwantz, Gardner etc. There was a lot of champions and future champions racing against each other in those days.
It goes to show that motogp is currently fairly open and you could even argue having a 'golden age' as we've had 4 world champions in the last 5 years. The previous 5 years had just one world champion so its quite dramatically different.
I don't think its been a success in many ways. The fact that no one rider has dominated the last 5 years is not a reflection of the technical formula in my opinion.
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You are a pathetic little ...... mateThere's been some pretty good data put forward here.
A little sensitive BM? Don't have a "melt down" because I was having a bit of fun with you on the Barry Manilow one, you gotta admit, it was pretty funny. What I meant by your demise was your insistence on trying to be right on the "backing it in" subject, when I think you've lost that one. But you wanted to continue attacking, like a moth does the light (the light being the truth), which finally resulted in Arrabi 'lighting' you up most hilariously. Its that one subject I'm referring to, because as you know, I've had very little exchange with you on other opinions. Btw, saying you had a reputation was not a dig at you, but rather again, a dig at Talps etal who just can't wrap their minds around somebody else being considered great.
Anyway, carry on little buddy.
Going along with some of the objections for this season being considered among one of the best, why do you consider 08; if Casey, who had 280 points is the most points of a runner up ever earned (that is, points from a rider earned in a year that rider did not take the title.) The implication being, the champ didn't actually rout the rivals. Perhaps I'm thinking that the best ever would have won by the biggest margin to his competitors? Honestly, following your logic, I could make a case that 06 was the best season ever for the champ (of course to many, I would be wrong).
What do you mean there were not many takers for the 07 season? I think its more a function of popularity rather than reality.
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Can anybody here really honestly say that Jorge's season this year is even close to the best of all time.......????
I'm certainly a fan of Gorgeous George, and predicted he would be the strongest challenger for the title this year.
In saying this-this thread is Rubbish-from the king of Diarrhea himself, he has been soundly beaten at many rounds this year, his lack of a crash and very consistent top 4 form has amassed the points. Only Seven wins at present which is still a far cry from recent success's like Rossi's 11 wins in 2005, 2002 and 2001, the latter on the stroker. Notably these earlier seasons only had 16 rounds, so at this point, the 16 round mark, Rossi had 351 points in 2005, 355 points in 2002, and 325 points in 2001. Stoner also had 367 points in 2007 with 10 wins-albeit with 18 rounds though. And I won't even bother going back any further, but I'm sure there are others.
Currently Jorge has 333
Adding to this, Pedders serious injury. Rossi 2 Serious injuries, Spies a rookie and Stoner crashing every second round........And of course his competitors woes are not a valid argument, but it seems Jorge's woes are being included-and were included last year and the year before-so why not?
Yes he had a wrist problem at qatar, but most of his complaint about this was made at the qatar test weeks earlier, with Motegi volcanised it was subsequently not mentioned again and clearly not a problem.
The man clearly deserves his title and has ridden brilliantly, but to infer it could be the greatest of all time is nothing more than a pathetic dig at his rivals (fans), interestingly enough the moronic author is dissing his own boys currently greater achievements in the process......involuntary reverse bopperism
Very Well said,
It's exactly how i see it.
While Horhay deserves all the credits for his championship and his 7 wins, but to name this season the best ever, looks a bit like being in hurry to forget about those real one's like those of Rossi or Stoner, or Barry is just fishing.
anyway Lorenzo's achivements will still shine for itself, and i,m sure he will have even better seasons than this one, so let's not hurry.
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Tell that to Talpa, who started his first post here (as he does quite usually) with the premise: its stupid to even consider this question, simply because 1. its not his boy we are considering the greatest, and 2. BM started thread so it must be rubbish.
Cut to the chase Factory, which of Rossi's seasons do you consider to be the greatest of all time? I'm sure that's what Talps and Inam want to hear as well. But trust, just like you make a list of reasons why its not so great, I can equally make a list of why any such seasons had its unique circumstances, of course I would be wrong, right? Even though you plainly stated "Lorenzo scored the most points to win the title." Its pretty simple, Talps, inam, and your protest all come from one place.
And yes, Lorenzo clearly snubbing Spies & Rossi certainly factors into this discussion.
Rubbish, ........, Horseshit, Goatshit and some Drivel to boot, .... man you are worse than a broken record.........
Answer my question, Do you really consider Jorge's season to be anywhere near the 'Greatest' of all time? I note that nobody has posted a 'yes' vote, thus proving my point.
I didn't want to go back too far so I didn't, but I will for those who missed the pre-2006 years........
Lets take Mick Doohan 1997 shall we. Note Mick was Riding the 2 stroke ballistic missile know as the NSR500 with 'no' electronics, with limited use of his right leg using a thumb rear brake. Oh Mick was on Michelin Tyres-maybe they were an unfair advantage back then too, or did that only happen after 2000.......?
15 rounds only-3 less than 2010......
15 race starts
TWELVE wins
1 DNF whilst in the lead by TWELVE seconds at PI-I know as I was there
the other two rounds 2nd places
This included an extraordinary run of 10 wins in a ROW.
340 points-which is seven more than Jorge at present after 16 rounds- 1 more than 1997-there is no valid comparison......
Mick's season in 1997 cannot be described as anything but truly great, and is worthy to be mentioned in the 'Greatest of all time' category.
In the recent era, Rossi, Stoner and Mick Doohan have all well exceeded Jorge's 2010 effort.
Does this not prove my point of the nature of the thread, argument for argument's sake.
Debate is only good when arguments are backed up with 'FACT'. So far only one side has provided them-nothing new.
BM, I was supporting your thread while having a go at Talps for dismissing it.
A little sensitive BM? Don't have a "melt down" because I was having a bit of fun with you on the Barry Manilow one, you gotta admit, it was pretty funny. What I meant by your demise was your insistence on trying to be right on the "backing it in" subject, when I think you've lost that one. But you wanted to continue attacking, like a moth does the light (the light being the truth), which finally resulted in Arrabi 'lighting' you up most hilariously. Its that one subject I'm referring to, because as you know, I've had very little exchange with you on other opinions. Btw, saying you had a reputation was not a dig at you, but rather again, a dig at Talps etal who just can't wrap their minds around somebody else being considered great.
Anyway, carry on little buddy.
Going along with some of the objections for this season being considered among one of the best, why do you consider 08; if Casey, who had 280 points is the most points of a runner up ever earned (that is, points from a rider earned in a year that rider did not take the title.) The implication being, the champ didn't actually rout the rivals. Perhaps I'm thinking that the best ever would have won by the biggest margin to his competitors? Honestly, following your logic, I could make a case that 06 was the best season ever for the champ (of course to many, I would be wrong).
What do you mean there were not many takers for the 07 season? I think its more a function of popularity rather than reality.
Purely in terms of how well he rode, basically flawlessly except for the one off; even in the late season race where he fell in practice he came from well down the grid to finish on the podium. He made more mistakes in 2009, and whilst stoner's challenge petered out after his 2 falls post-laguna he was looking to have dominant or potentially dominant pace for several races , so don't think jorge was any harder opposition in 2009.
Stoner's 2007 season was basically flawless in terms of riding as well except perhaps motegi where he rode to clinch the title; rossi himself said he rode "like a god". Statistically it is hard to match also, particularly for the points gap as you imply. At the moment I am happy to give credit to the winners of the championships since then until casey has another such season, hopefully next year.
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Of course you do. I wouldn't expect anything else.
But i Do expect this .... from you mr Garrison as always your trying to correct others .
Talpa gave his opinion + some facts/numbers (which is the reason for this thread) and he has been fair to Lorenzo.
What did you bring to our attention? nothing but your bs mr Garrison.
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Rubbish, ........, Horseshit, Goatshit and some Drivel to boot, .... man you are worse than a broken record.........
Answer my question, Do you really consider Jorge's season to be anywhere near the 'Greatest' of all time? I note that nobody has posted a 'yes' vote, thus proving my point.
I didn't want to go back too far so I didn't, but I will for those who missed the pre-2006 years........
Lets take Mick Doohan 1997 shall we. Note Mick was Riding the 2 stroke ballistic missile know as the NSR500 with 'no' electronics, with limited use of his right leg using a thumb rear brake. Oh Mick was on Michelin Tyres-maybe they were an unfair advantage back then too, or did that only happen after 2000.......?
15 rounds only-3 less than 2010......
15 race starts
TWELVE wins
1 DNF whilst in the lead by TWELVE seconds at PI-I know as I was there
the other two rounds 2nd places
This included an extraordinary run of 10 wins in a ROW.
340 points-which is seven more than Jorge at present after 16 rounds- 1 more than 1997-there is no valid comparison......
Mick's season in 1997 cannot be described as anything but truly great, and is worthy to be mentioned in the 'Greatest of all time' category.
In the recent era, Rossi, Stoner and Mick Doohan have all well exceeded Jorge's 2010 effort.
Does this not prove my point of the nature of the thread, argument for argument's sake.
Debate is only good when arguments are backed up with 'FACT'. So far only one side has provided them-nothing new.
And then mr Messiah Garrison shamelessly ignores these numbers and forgets the title of the thread is The best season ever ( and not one of the...) and that Based on the winner's total points at the end of a season.
After all everybody can/will have his/her own idea and that wont take anything away from Horhay's impressive championship.
If the total points of the winner is the best way to value a championship and Horhay indeed get to that point we promiss to call him god, otherwise mr Garrison will acuse us of something.
Rubbish, ........, Horseshit, Goatshit and some Drivel to boot, .... man you are worse than a broken record.........
Answer my question, Do you really consider Jorge's season to be anywhere near the 'Greatest' of all time? I note that nobody has posted a 'yes' vote, thus proving my point.
I didn't want to go back too far so I didn't, but I will for those who missed the pre-2006 years........
Lets take Mick Doohan 1997 shall we. Note Mick was Riding the 2 stroke ballistic missile know as the NSR500 with 'no' electronics, with limited use of his right leg using a thumb rear brake. Oh Mick was on Michelin Tyres-maybe they were an unfair advantage back then too, or did that only happen after 2000.......?
15 rounds only-3 less than 2010......
15 race starts
TWELVE wins
1 DNF whilst in the lead by TWELVE seconds at PI-I know as I was there
the other two rounds 2nd places
This included an extraordinary run of 10 wins in a ROW.
340 points-which is seven more than Jorge at present after 16 rounds- 1 more than 1997-there is no valid comparison......
Mick's season in 1997 cannot be described as anything but truly great, and is worthy to be mentioned in the 'Greatest of all time' category.
In the recent era, Rossi, Stoner and Mick Doohan have all well exceeded Jorge's 2010 effort.
Does this not prove my point of the nature of the thread, argument for argument's sake.
Debate is only good when arguments are backed up with 'FACT'. So far only one side has provided them-nothing new.
Absolutely agree about Doohan.....thats why I`m a fan.
Are you implying that this season isn't 'real'
That is a very rigid way to look at things. Now i am a scientist but even i realize that in a discussion or debate, especially one of this nature has a degree of opinion. It is not simply a matter of right or wrong.
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Really
I say that in the sense that i am not an arty person nor do i have a lot of faith or religion. I am not a scientist by proffession, but i am by nature. If you know what i mean
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800s sucked ..... 990s ruled all.. here's to them not ....... up the 1000s. :drinks
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A concept Talps is having trouble with here. His proof, as he said, is that nobody has said "yes" to this thread.
I didn't realize this was a poll. But anyway, tho your question above...
Yes. (this should now dissolve your logic.)
Look at BM's thread title and first post. You see this symbol> "?" Its called a question mark. BM is not stating this season is the greatest as fact, but its close enough that he's opening it up for debate. BTW, the points you posted comparing Doohan's to Lorenzo's this year are fairly close, not even seperated by more than 10 points. This makes the seasons in regards to comparable (and we are not even adjusting for a change in points system). Now take into account that during those years, any informed journalist will tell you, if you were not on a factory Honda, you were equivalent to a satellite bike in todays terms. Today, its quite a different story as even you have conceded that the three top factories have much more parity (unlike Doohan's day). I realize you have trouble with profound analysis when it comes to your boy being compared to anything other that sublime perection. As your first protest was to say BM was just trying to have a go at the rivals "(fans)", which may are may not be true, but I couldn't for sure detect it in his original post, since he infact turned it into a 'question' for us to debate.
Oh wait, almost forgot, here are a few numbers to make you happy. 349859324879247024387502 (That is about as meaningful as yours without deeper analysis of what they mean when making the difficult attempt to compare across seasons, much less eras.)
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