Austrian GP 2016

Jumkie · Aug 13, 2016

Gaz said:

This is the second time I almost .... my pants. Twice now I've feared Rossi would get the title by default. Rossi is in contention artificially as it is, thanks to Dornaichelin. It's a odds game. When Spies was shitcanned, Rossi was a 1:4. All Dorna needed really was get Rossi on the podium to keep the minions tuned in. Then they realized, hey, why stop there. If we can usher Rossi back to a manufacturer that didn’t want him back, hell we can do better than that. Bridgestone got shitcanned next. Now the whole grid must adapt to SNS. Rossi is 1:2 odds now that Lorenzo has been eliminated. Maybe next year will be the payoff. Rossi would be leading today without his mistakes. 2017 (if not this year). After all, Marquez is just one front end crash away from season ending injury.

If you live in a glass house, don't throw rocks.

moto vudu · Aug 13, 2016

Lol, Jums just took the Marquez & Pedrosa incident and made it ENTIRELY about Rossi. Hahaha, dude is on a roll tonight!

pyeman · Aug 13, 2016

Jumkie said:
If Rossi was having as much trouble with the tires as Lorenzo, he would have been threatening to quit...again. These are Rossi spec tires, make no mistake. Anybody thinking otherwise is either ignorant, blind, stupid, or unaware of the ways of power.

Rossi's performance in both qual and race have been a revelation with Michelintino tires, so much so that it reminds me of a quote by Jim Lampley regarding rigged elections: "No matter how one calculates it, the discrepancy cannot be attributed to chance." You're right, the tires will continue to change, fine tuning to make them perfectly suited for Rossi. While everyone is repeating the ........ that Lorenzo is suffering from a crisis of confidence, the tire rigging, though obvious to its extreme, will continue unabashed. Partly because the GP media are chickenshit and the organizer know this, and mainly because, well MotoGP is Rossi--One in the same. Everything around it is filler. Like the CRT, created to provide you with a facade of competition.

If you live in a glass house, don't throw rocks.

I thought it was quite interesting during FP3 when Rossi pulled back into his garage and the Michelin main man Goofy Goober,[wasn't he in Spongebob?],was waiting to check out his rear tyre and give the great one his undivided attention,i was wondering if everyone else got such personal service from the head Of Michelin's race department?.

JPSLotus · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
Lol, Jums just took the Marquez & Pedrosa incident and made it ENTIRELY about Rossi. Hahaha, dude is on a roll tonight!

So what?

It's not like his point isn't accurate.

Most GP fans are dumb as .... because they still cannot comprehend that the real odds for Rossi to win a race is 1:3 right now. Pedrosa can't even use these tires. So his only competition is Lorenzo and Marquez....and Lorenzo can easily be taken out of the equation. Rossi made a number of errors already this season, which is the only reason he isn't right near MM in the points. But using a tire construct which was designed with input from Rossi's former teammate/minion Colin Edwards still doesn't register with anyone as being highly problematic.

Even better is how Rossi was what, something like 8 tenths to 1 second off the pace in Q2 during his first stint? He pits, changes tires, and then magically once again finds enough time to nearly be on pole position? He's been doing this every race, and yet no one seems to find this odd. There's not a progression of decreasing lap times, it goes 1st stint, middle of the pack to 2nd stint, front row.

I must have been one of the few watching Q2 who was neither enthused or on the edge of my seat since it was obvious Rossi/Yamaha had massively cut the Ducati gap down. Ducati's vaunted horsepower advantage still doesn't mean .... since they can't maintain the cornering speed the M1 or RCV have, and that's how you win races in modern GP. Ducati won't even win tomorrow. Iannone is a crash waiting to happen, and Dovi proved again why I don't rate him as a top flight rider. He ...... up coming into the double right-handers on his penultimate Q2 lap and lost a shitload of time. Yes he managed to do a better lap the next go around without the ....-up, but point is both Ducati riders are not consistent enough, and they also are competing against two factory teams that have been beating the .... out of them since 2008. Casey Stoner is the only reason they have any wins since 2006. Take him out of the mix, and that "they haven't won since 2010" is more like "they haven't won in 10 years."

GP is rigged for Yamaha and Honda. Michelin tires are rigged for Rossi.

Yet you guys still believe this is all on the up-and-up, and that everything is legit. The only bike to be on in GP is the Yamaha M1. Marquez is the only person who can ride the factory RCV to wins on the planet right now.

birdman · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
What's your take on why Lorenzo clearly attempted to tuck in behind Iannone? For someone that has made it clear he hates towing, he tried to do it himself.

To get a closer look at his ride for next year. Maybe thinking get rid of those ....... yellow highlights. Or maybe just ....! What have I done?

moto vudu · Aug 13, 2016

JPSLotus said:
So what?

It's not like his point isn't accurate.

Most GP fans are dumb as .... because they still cannot comprehend that the real odds for Rossi to win a race is 1:3 right now. Pedrosa can't even use these tires. So his only competition is Lorenzo and Marquez....and Lorenzo can easily be taken out of the equation. Rossi made a number of errors already this season, which is the only reason he isn't right near MM in the points. But using a tire construct which was designed with input from Rossi's former teammate/minion Colin Edwards still doesn't register with anyone as being highly problematic.

Even better is how Rossi was what, something like 8 tenths to 1 second off the pace in Q2 during his first stint? He pits, changes tires, and then magically once again finds enough time to nearly be on pole position? He's been doing this every race, and yet no one seems to find this odd. There's not a progression of decreasing lap times, it goes 1st stint, middle of the pack to 2nd stint, front row.

I must have been one of the few watching Q2 who was neither enthused or on the edge of my seat since it was obvious Rossi/Yamaha had massively cut the Ducati gap down. Ducati's vaunted horsepower advantage still doesn't mean .... since they can't maintain the cornering speed the M1 or RCV have, and that's how you win races in modern GP. Ducati won't even win tomorrow. Iannone is a crash waiting to happen, and Dovi proved again why I don't rate him as a top flight rider. He ...... up coming into the double left-handers on his penultimate Q2 lap and lost a shitload of time. Yes he managed to do a better lap the next go around without the ....-up, but point is both Ducati riders are not consistent enough, and they also are competing against two factory teams that have been beating the .... out of them since 2008. Casey Stoner is the only reason they have any wins since 2006. Take him out of the mix, and that "they haven't won since 2010" is more like "they haven't won in 10 years."

GP is rigged for Yamaha and Honda. Michelin tires are rigged for Rossi.

Yet you guys still believe this is all on the up-and-up, and that everything is legit. The only bike to be on in GP is the Yamaha M1. Marquez is the only person who can ride the factory RCV to wins on the planet right now.

I'm not going to breakdown your entire post because I'm having more fun racing a La Ferrari around Red Bull Ring in Assetto Corsa. But, if you believe all of what you just wrote, why do you still watch Moto GP? For the past 2 days you have been upset, I have to assume that even though you kept saying you didn't think Stoner would race... you were secretly hoping he would. When you got the news that Ducati offered to enter him as a wildcard and he refused, you were heartbroken.

JPSLotus · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
I'm not going to breakdown your entire post because I'm having more fun racing a La Ferrari around Red Bull Ring in Assetto Corsa. But, if you believe all of what you just wrote, why do you still watch Moto GP? For the past 2 days you have been upset, I have to assume that even though you kept saying you didn't think Stoner would race... you were secretly hoping he would. When you got the news that Ducati offered to enter him as a wildcard and he refused, you were heartbroken.

Yet here you are still replying in spite of having more fun. You can't make this .... up. Frivolous comment if there ever were one to be had from you Vudu.

Heartbroken?

lol

Nah dude, it's always been an inside joke among me and a few people here. I never believed he would race because he has some larger point to prove, which I've never agreed with. I think he turned into a hypocrite in recent times, who is completely oblivious to the hypocrisy that he spews in all of these interviews. If you ever really read his interviews, there's so much contradictory .... from interview to interview. He's never been remotely consistent about certain points. FYI, the only place he would race if he were going to race, is Phillip Island.

michaelm · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
I'm not going to breakdown your entire post because I'm having more fun racing a La Ferrari around Red Bull Ring in Assetto Corsa. But, if you believe all of what you just wrote, why do you still watch Moto GP? For the past 2 days you have been upset, I have to assume that even though you kept saying you didn't think Stoner would race... you were secretly hoping he would. When you got the news that Ducati offered to enter him as a wildcard and he refused, you were heartbroken.

Surely your can't doubt his contention about the Honda-Yamaha duopoly?

And like me, it is possible he has watched Lorenzo, Marquez or Stoner win the last 6 world championships, not that I personally was best pleased about the 2 MM titles, although the way he is comporting himself now I would welcome a 3rd title win by him.

michaelm · Aug 13, 2016

JPSLotus said:
Yet here you are still replying in spite of having more fun. You can't make this .... up. Frivolous comment if there ever were one to be had from you Vudu.

Heartbroken?

lol

Nah dude, it's always been an inside joke among me and a few people here. I never believed he would race because he has some larger point to prove, which I've never agreed with. I think he turned into a hypocrite in recent times, who is completely oblivious to the hypocrisy that he spews in all of these interviews. If you ever really read his interviews, there's so much contradictory .... from interview to interview. He's never been remotely consistent about certain points. FYI, the only place he would race if he were going to race, is Phillip Island.

It has ever been thus. He has always been uncomfortable, and inconsistent in his statements, in general interviews but is on occasion more reflective and coherent in longer one-on-one interviews.

To answer MV in kind, perhaps he still considers actual GP racing to be a Rossi/Dorna circus, which doesn't however have much influence on him when he is being purely a test rider. I am sure he still likes riding gp bikes fast.

JPSLotus · Aug 13, 2016

michaelm said:
It has ever been thus. He has always been uncomfortable, and inconsistent in his statements, in general interviews but is on occasion more reflective and coherent in longer one-on-one interviews.

To answer MV in kind, perhaps he still considers actual GP racing to be a Rossi/Dorna circus, which doesn't however have much influence on him when he is being purely a test rider. I am sure he still likes riding gp bikes fast.

I think he's more comfortable nowadays than anyone gives him credit for. These interviews have all been one-on-one affairs.

If he enjoys riding GP bikes fast, it's certainly a curious look since he spends plenty of time slagging off the current GP bikes. I don't dispute some of his assertions about technique required on the current GP bikes, but he was less than flattering about the current bikes as a whole in one of his recent interviews.

povol · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
It's not always planned to exit pit lane as a specific rider is passing the pits. Many times riders leaving the pits end up stuck in traffic and it hurts their qualifying time. So timing their pit lane exit properly is not always planned. In the past, when Iannone sought out Lorenzo for a tow, he pitted at the same time as Lorenzo and stayed on him. This time, I'm not so sure Iannone was planning on a tow from Lorenzo because he was doing his own thing. Lorenzo actually aborted a flying lap to attempt to get behind Iannone who was just starting his out-lap.

Or aborted a flying lap once he saw Ianoone waiting on him.

moto vudu · Aug 13, 2016

povol said:
Or aborted a flying lap once he saw Ianoone waiting on him.

It's debatable if Iannone tried to time his pit lane exit to Lorenzo coming down the straight, but it's clear that Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow from Iannone.

Between the two of them, Lorenzo was the one who needed a tow aka tricycle the most.

Gaz · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
It's debatable if Iannone tried to time his pit lane exit to Lorenzo coming down the straight, but it's clear that Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow from Iannone.

One is debatable yet the other is clear .

You Lorenzo hater you

moto vudu · Aug 13, 2016

Gaz said:
One is debatable yet the other is clear .

You Lorenzo hater you

Iannone may have left the pits without paying any attention to Lorenzo. But Lorenzo clearly pulled off the line and tried to get behind Iannone. Loronzo has no deniability.

Aw Mang · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
It's debatable if Iannone tried to time his pit lane exit to Lorenzo coming down the straight, but it's clear that Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow from Iannone.

Between the two of them, Lorenzo was the one who needed a tow aka tricycle the most.

]

It's a fact that Iannone has gotten a few tows from Lorenzo before, while Lorenzo has never tried to get a tow from anybody and even spoke against towing. If past events are any indication, it's more likely that Lorenzo pulled over because he didn't want Iannone to get a tow from him again, not the other way around.

Gaz · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
Iannone may have left the pits without paying any attention to Lorenzo. But Lorenzo clearly pulled off the line and tried to get behind Iannone. Loronzo has no deniability.

To YOU he has no deniability as you simply would not believe him no matter what he said (as I asked , did he take your last chip one day) but just as you hypothesise that Ianonne may 'not have paid attention' it is also quite possible that JL was pulling offline to blow his nose, adjust his undies, take a selfie (...., who wouldn't want a selfie on GP bike), perhaps even he had completed his fast run for the moment.

Facts are not known, but hypotheticals abound.

A fact is that Ianonne is on pole ............ a Hypothetical is that Dovisioso could have been on pole .

Gaz · Aug 13, 2016

Aw Mang said:
It's a fact that Iannone has gotten a few tows from Lorenzo before, while Lorenzo has never tried to get a tow from anybody and even spoke against towing. If past events are any indication, it's more likely that Lorenzo pulled over because he didn't want Iannone to get a tow from him again, not the other way around.

But in some eyes since last year, Lorenzo is the root of all evil because he does not smile, or laugh, hell he takes his job seriously .............

On the serious side I agree, I cannot recall JL ever getting a tow (it may have happened but is so rare that people do not discuss him doing it)

moto vudu · Aug 13, 2016

Aw Mang said:
It's a fact that Iannone has gotten a few tows from Lorenzo before, while Lorenzo has never tried to get a tow from anybody and even spoke against towing. If past events are any indication, it's more likely that Lorenzo pulled over because he didn't want Iannone to get a tow from him again, not the other way around.

Gaz said:
To YOU he has no deniability as you simply would not believe him no matter what he said (as I asked , did he take your last chip one day) but just as you hypothesise that Ianonne may 'not have paid attention' it is also quite possible that JL was pulling offline to blow his nose, adjust his undies, take a selfie (...., who wouldn't want a selfie on GP bike), perhaps even he had completed his fast run for the moment.

Facts are not known, but hypotheticals abound.

A fact is that Ianonne is on pole ............ a Hypothetical is that Dovisioso could have been on pole .

As soon as Iannone passed Lorenzo, Lorenzo went WOT (wide open throttle) to tuck in behind him. Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow. He had already aborted his flying lap, if he didn't anything to do with Iannone, he would have let him go.

I'm not even mad at Lorenzo for attempting to improve his grid position by getting a tow from one of Ducs. It's just hypocritical of him.

Gaz · Aug 13, 2016

moto vudu said:
As soon as Iannone passed Lorenzo, Lorenzo went WOT (wide open throttle) to tuck in behind him. Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow. He had already aborted his flying lap, if he didn't anything to do with Iannone, he would have let him go.

Ever think that what he was after was not a tow but a comparison lap?

Riders can and will follow others not for a tow, but where that other is faster (Ianonne is on the Ducati .......... next year will be different) so that they can get a face to face comparison of strong and weak points on the track.

Personally I have NFI as to whether this was done but it does occur and it is actually a good tactic as if you can do this in practice you can learn where you may be able to take advantage and out manouver the faster rider during the race.

Said it many times and will say it again, Rossi did this brilliantly at LS all those years ago. He watched and learnt where and how to use his advantage to inhibit the advantage of the other bike (interestingly, the very same brands of which we speak today)

moto vudu said:
I'm not even mad at Lorenzo for attempting to improve his grid position by getting a tow from one of Ducs. It's just hypocritical of him.

No more hypocritical (again, if your supposition/accusation is correct) than it is to make public statements that you would never again ride for a Tobacco sponsor and find yourself so sponsored.

That said, I doubt JL was trying to receive a tow anyway due to his vehement opposition to the tactic but as with so many things, we read or view with our own perceptions, be they pre-conceived or not.

michaelm · Aug 14, 2016

moto vudu said:
As soon as Iannone passed Lorenzo, Lorenzo went WOT (wide open throttle) to tuck in behind him. Lorenzo definitely tried to get a tow. He had already aborted his flying lap, if he didn't anything to do with Iannone, he would have let him go.

I'm not even mad at Lorenzo for attempting to improve his grid position by getting a tow from one of Ducs. It's just hypocritical of him.

Given the precedents which have been set, it is pretty much open slather now, with few limits to what Lorenzo could do without becoming the biggest hypocrite on the grid while Rossi's career continues, just as your opponents on here can say pretty much whatever they like without ceding the moral high ground to you while you continue to defend Rossi's late career malfeasance, particularly given his own conspiracy theories which he deliberately promulgated to the media at large, and to attack his competitors on moral equivalence grounds which are spurious in the extreme.

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