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September 3rd, 2007, 08:04 AM   #1
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Is it really sensible to ditch traction control?The arguments against it are to get riders connecting with their bikes but we haven`t really scratched the surface of how it`s keeping a lot of riders away from the Costa clinic.

Personally in the past I`ve been all for getting rid of it but as in F1 all measures to slow bikes down are countered by new engineering that gives the power back from elsewhere in the engine or better electronics being developed for the machine.

What worries me most is another incident like the late,great Kato thing occuring again and seeing riders knock themselves about so much that they become sidelined permanently which has robbed us of good talent in the past. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif[/img]


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September 3rd, 2007, 08:14 AM   #2
 
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It is impossible to completely take traction control out of the equation. The teams will find a way to modulate control though the computer that controls the bikes injectors. AMA did it last year and that is why the AMA amended the rules to allow full traction control because they could not police the other "quasi" traction control. I do not think there is a way to fully take control out of the equation.
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September 3rd, 2007, 08:20 AM   #3
 
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its a tricky question.
i dont like the fact that computers are doing the racing rather than the riders. i think keeping riders out of the costa clinic is good.
fact is ,there are a lot more people comparing motogp to the boring F1,and thats not good for the sport, i think a lot of this is attributed to the tc.
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September 3rd, 2007, 09:15 AM   #4
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eagle088 @ Sep 3 2007, 11:14 AM) [snapback]88576[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
It is impossible to completely take traction control out of the equation. The teams will find a way to modulate control though the computer that controls the bikes injectors. AMA did it last year and that is why the AMA amended the rules to allow full traction control because they could not police the other "quasi" traction control. I do not think there is a way to fully take control out of the equation.

The only semi-realistic ways to really police TC are going away from computer controls completely or running a control ECU. If you've got a computer controlling your throttle, you can implement TC using only the sensors already in place. It's a difficult thing to police without swinging either too far backwards or too far towards a spec series.
mattsteg is offline  
September 3rd, 2007, 10:14 AM   #5
 
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annoying isnt it.

traction control has an obvious downside in making the bikes much easier to ride and reducing the advantage of the skillful rider.

but it also has an upside in that as long as it doesnt go wrong it can potentially make the sport much safer.

valentinorossi is offline  
September 3rd, 2007, 01:42 PM   #6
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DRILL666 @ Sep 3 2007, 05:04 PM) [snapback]88575[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Is it really sensible to ditch traction control?The arguments against it are to get riders connecting with their bikes but we haven`t really scratched the surface of how it`s keeping a lot of riders away from the Costa clinic.

Personally in the past I`ve been all for getting rid of it but as in F1 all measures to slow bikes down are countered by new engineering that gives the power back from elsewhere in the engine or better electronics being developed for the machine.

What worries me most is another incident like the late,great Kato thing occuring again and seeing riders knock themselves about so much that they become sidelined permanently which has robbed us of good talent in the past. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif[/img]


Agree with everything you've said mate, except for the bolded bit.

Kato's accident was a REALLY freak accident, it had nothing to do with the bike, well, unless you believe the melted break theory.
phleg is offline  
September 4th, 2007, 11:12 PM   #7
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Is there anyway they can make it manual so the rider has to use it at his peril which would not be possible every corner and give them something to seriously think about. Riders like Nicky and Vale who wouldn't need it all the time would probably be faster than the boys flickin switches. (De Puniet, Stoner)

Just a though. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img]
an4rew is offline  
September 5th, 2007, 01:13 AM   #8
 
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I started reading this article & thought to myself that this is very relevant to this discussion...

http://www.speedtv.com/articles/moto/motogp/25599/

But then I noticed that some of the comments weren't quite fitting in with my memory of this years events & when I checked the date of the article it was written back in 2006!

The interesting part about it it that all the comments were about the same issues that are being discussed here, except that they are applying it to last years events...

And I thought that many people hold the 2006 season in high regard for it's competitiveness...

so what gives??? [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif[/img]
muzzy57 is offline  
September 5th, 2007, 01:32 AM   #9
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eagle088 @ Sep 3 2007, 05:14 PM) [snapback]88576[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
It is impossible to completely take traction control out of the equation. The teams will find a way to modulate control though the computer that controls the bikes injectors. AMA did it last year and that is why the AMA amended the rules to allow full traction control because they could not police the other "quasi" traction control. I do not think there is a way to fully take control out of the equation.
This is the problem. There may be an attempt to phase it out. However without a control ECU, it's impossible to police.

Is it safe to race without it, of course it is. It would change a lot of things but it would still be safe, maybe the odd high side here and there but that's racing.
skidmark is offline  
September 5th, 2007, 12:24 PM   #10
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DRILL666 @ Sep 3 2007, 09:04 AM) [snapback]88575[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Is it really sensible to ditch traction control?The arguments against it are to get riders connecting with their bikes but we haven`t really scratched the surface of how it`s keeping a lot of riders away from the Costa clinic.

Personally in the past I`ve been all for getting rid of it but as in F1 all measures to slow bikes down are countered by new engineering that gives the power back from elsewhere in the engine or better electronics being developed for the machine.

What worries me most is another incident like the late,great Kato thing occuring again and seeing riders knock themselves about so much that they become sidelined permanently which has robbed us of good talent in the past. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif[/img]


highsiding (which is what most people think of when speaking about TC and safety) doesn't have the disastrous results that most people seem to think it does. sure, it's painful and looks devastating; but try to think of a highside in the last X # of years that resulted in severe injury or death... there aren't any. the really bad injuries are not from highsides; kato, rainey, locatelli, et al; they are usually from other factors. (yes, doohan almost lost his leg in a highside in 92, but it was because he touched the paint; something that at the time even TC wouldn't have helped).

getting rid of TC now would be great because we would instantly get to see how hard the riders are depending on it; i wonder where all the usual players would end up on the grid. however, actually doing it? not possible unless you go back to carbs and/or strokers.

but anyways, i submit that TC hasn't made racing any safer in the grand scheme of things than going from 990 to 800cc has made racing any safer in the grand scheme of things.
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