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August 26th, 2020, 08:49 PM   #11
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^^ I believe their engine produced just over 1000 hp in qualifying but not for the races though.
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August 27th, 2020, 05:33 AM   #12
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The energy in gasoline is constant. To burn it and get more horsepower than competition you need to increase the efficiency of internal combustion engine. Sure, you can get a big number of horsepower with unlimited fuel available. During MotoGP race the fuel amount is limited. The efficiency of gasoline engine was under 40% for a long time (diesel is a little better). Increasing efficiency is not a walk in the park, every 0.1% comes with huge research expenses. At some point there will be nothing one can do to increase the efficiency. I doubt the gasoline engine ever will go better than 50%. Thus, such a hypothetical 1000 HP engine is plain useless, money spent in wrong direction.
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August 27th, 2020, 06:30 AM   #13
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The energy in gasoline is constant. To burn it and get more horsepower than competition you need to increase the efficiency of internal combustion engine. Sure, you can get a big number of horsepower with unlimited fuel available. During MotoGP race the fuel amount is limited. The efficiency of gasoline engine was under 40% for a long time (diesel is a little better). Increasing efficiency is not a walk in the park, every 0.1% comes with huge research expenses. At some point there will be nothing one can do to increase the efficiency. I doubt the gasoline engine ever will go better than 50%. Thus, such a hypothetical 1000 HP engine is plain useless, money spent in wrong direction.
Absolutely, that was then though when power was the goal. My only point was that they did once build a winning F1 engine, for Bernie actually, the owner of the Brabham BMW team in 1983. Plus ca change. Bernie was considered one of the good guys then, leading the fight against the evil Ballestre.
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August 27th, 2020, 06:54 AM   #14
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They got 1500 BHP out of a 1500 cc turbocharged F1 engine, for qualification. The lifespan of an F1 engine in "qualification mode" was counted in minutes. The fuel wasn't regular gasoline, the recipe was secret for every team. Nothing like this has place in MotoGP where even 250 BHP engine is limited in first 4 gears by wheelie control. Adding 700 more horsepower would add very little, definitely not worth the spending and R&D.
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August 27th, 2020, 10:14 AM   #15
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There's a video that used to get posted here from time to time maybe 15 years ago. I think it was The Cube, maybe from Aprilia, that made insane horsepower, which the techs were completely incapable of taming in any useful way. Really funny to watch.
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August 27th, 2020, 04:50 PM   #16
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There's a video that used to get posted here from time to time maybe 15 years ago. I think it was The Cube, maybe from Aprilia, that made insane horsepower, which the techs were completely incapable of taming in any useful way. Really funny to watch.
Yes, the Aprilia Cube, with an engine developed by Cosworth. They signed Colin Edwards iirc. Not only was the thing unrideable, he had other adventures such as the engine catching on fire.

I think BMW make good road cars, but have never owned one and never will, I actually have a Honda, a Civic Type R currently. There is no reason they would get to the front any quicker than KTM in motogp though imo, and KTM had a strong history in the other GP classes and in bike racing in general. I believe that is one reason they will never participate, I consider it likely they would consider even circulating in the low mid pack while they developed their bike/got up to speed damaging to their prestige. It is cool imo that something somewhat based on a fairly humble 1500 cc 4 cylinder road car engine was the most powerful F1 engine ever, dead end though that technology was for F1.
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August 28th, 2020, 01:58 AM   #17
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Kawasaki are multiple winners of WSB. How about BMW, have they even won once, let alone Motogp.

I had confidence in KTM making it in motogp and sure, Pedrosa was the last piece of the puzzle, rather than the steel trellis frame.
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August 28th, 2020, 11:56 AM   #18
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Kawasaki are multiple winners of WSB. How about BMW, have they even won once, let alone Motogp.

I had confidence in KTM making it in motogp and sure, Pedrosa was the last piece of the puzzle, rather than the steel trellis frame.
They won multiple times in the Superstock 1000 World championship, with bikes much closer to what is available to public in motor shops. Let`s not forget that the superbikes in WSBK are far away from stock, although in later years Dorna has imposed rules to level the field in WSBK, too.
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August 28th, 2020, 12:00 PM   #19
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They won multiple times in the Superstock 1000 World championship, with bikes much closer to what is available to public in motor shops. Let`s not forget that the superbikes in WSBK are far away from stock, although in later years Dorna has imposed rules to level the field in WSBK, too.
Superstock + MotoGp = Apples and Oranges. MotoGp is a MUCH steeper, not to mention much costlier, learning curve. If that were not the case Kawasaki would have jumped back into the fray years ago.

Last edited by Keshav; August 28th, 2020 at 12:31 PM.
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August 31st, 2020, 01:19 PM   #20
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BMW can build a decent street bike, but prototype racing is very different. I think their best option would be to start in Moto2, but even then I dont think it would be cost effective.
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