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November 11th, 2019, 10:17 AM   #41
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Lorenzo would go into no-suck mode on a different bike. (Not that he will be given that opportunity.) Rossi needs enormous luck to make it to the podium in Valencia.
He needs to qualify better and have more tyre performance in the latter half of the race. The last 2 races have really shown what the Yamahas are like. They lack top speed so they have to start up the grid, get a great race start AND maintain tyre performance to get good results. They lack the top speed to work through to the front.

VR lacks qualifying performance and race long performance. I'm afraid that Sepang will likely be a one-off in his tyre performance longevity. I do feel that his lack of showing has a lot to do with his bike setup etc. He has shown that he can be there if the bike/tyres are up to it. But then he will continue to be on the backfoot, struggling with getting better than 4th places if he is 0.7-0.8 sec off the top qualifying pace. The young guns are thrashing him in that regard.
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November 11th, 2019, 02:01 PM   #42
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I wouldn't take this tire talk too seriously. If anything goes wrong, and I mean anything, then in post race interview we hear "there was this grip issue". Sometimes there maybe was, and sometimes it means the rider does not want to talk about real issue.
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November 11th, 2019, 09:58 PM   #43
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I wouldn't take this tire talk too seriously. If anything goes wrong, and I mean anything, then in post race interview we hear "there was this grip issue". Sometimes there maybe was, and sometimes it means the rider does not want to talk about real issue.
Not if it's affecting so many of them and their performance in the races reflect the issue as well. The riders vary in height and weight as well which adds to the problem. Rossi and Morbidelli have to account for their qualifying performances, but they do have tyre preservation problems in the races. The same for Miller.
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November 12th, 2019, 12:29 AM   #44
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Not if it's affecting so many of them and their performance in the races reflect the issue as well. The riders vary in height and weight as well which adds to the problem. Rossi and Morbidelli have to account for their qualifying performances, but they do have tyre preservation problems in the races. The same for Miller.
Except for MM. Whatever issues he has, with tires or anything else, seem unable to restrict him to finishing lower than 2nd. If he makes the wrong tire choice he still seems able to ride around same and somehow get to the finish on the podium regardless.

I am all for tire diversity, and believe bikes with designs not strictly the Japanese aluminium twin spar frame norm or with unconventional engines, and riders with unconventional physiques or unconventional riding styles should be able to obtain tires which suit them. Valentino however voted against tire diversity once in 2012, and got his way with a mid season tire change and second rider vote in 2017, and I don’t see that he or his fans have much to complain about where tires are concerned.
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November 12th, 2019, 02:19 PM   #45
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Except for MM. Whatever issues he has, with tires or anything else, seem unable to restrict him to finishing lower than 2nd. If he makes the wrong tire choice he still seems able to ride around same and somehow get to the finish on the podium regardless.

I am all for tire diversity, and believe bikes with designs not strictly the Japanese aluminium twin spar frame norm or with unconventional engines, and riders with unconventional physiques or unconventional riding styles should be able to obtain tires which suit them. Valentino however voted against tire diversity once in 2012, and got his way with a mid season tire change and second rider vote in 2017, and I don’t see that he or his fans have much to complain about where tires are concerned.
It's not so much complaining as opposed to explaining a situation and trying to overcome it. As I said too, it's not only VR having this problem. Morbidelli and Miller are notably having the same issue. I don't see the Honda riders in general bringing up tyre longevity as a serious problem hampering their race results.
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November 12th, 2019, 04:58 PM   #46
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It's not so much complaining as opposed to explaining a situation and trying to overcome it. As I said too, it's not only VR having this problem. Morbidelli and Miller are notably having the same issue. I don't see the Honda riders in general bringing up tyre longevity as a serious problem hampering their race results.
A valid point, but MM is the main Honda rider who is competitive and seems to have an unusual ability to preserve tires or ride on worn/less than perfect tires similar to Rossi in his pomp. He himself has said on occasion he has made the wrong tire choice, although this year at least at worst he has had to make excuses for finishing second. I remember, iirc in 2017, he somehow got the bike home on tires which shouldn't have lasted in a mixed condition race in which Jorge I think had a tire delamination on a Ducati.

I do see some karma in this for Rossi though, apart from the 2 mid-season tire changes in which he was involved he probably had a major role in the advent of the control tire in the first place, which followed his demand to have the Bridegstones in 2018 which reputedly involved off track pressure from him, perhaps even threats to retire. I have always thought Yamaha should have supported Vinales more in 2017 in his wish to continue on the tire with which he started and on which he had initially prospered, as well. I had no problem with the "new"/old tire being brought in but supply of the other tire should have continued for the remainder of that season imo, something Dorna have I belive now recognised and made a rule concerning same.
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November 13th, 2019, 06:12 AM   #47
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A valid point, but MM is the main Honda rider who is competitive and seems to have an unusual ability to preserve tires or ride on worn/less than perfect tires similar to Rossi in his pomp. He himself has said on occasion he has made the wrong tire choice, although this year at least at worst he has had to make excuses for finishing second. I remember, iirc in 2017, he somehow got the bike home on tires which shouldn't have lasted in a mixed condition race in which Jorge I think had a tire delamination on a Ducati.

I do see some karma in this for Rossi though, apart from the 2 mid-season tire changes in which he was involved he probably had a major role in the advent of the control tire in the first place, which followed his demand to have the Bridegstones in 2018 which reputedly involved off track pressure from him, perhaps even threats to retire. I have always thought Yamaha should have supported Vinales more in 2017 in his wish to continue on the tire with which he started and on which he had initially prospered, as well. I had no problem with the "new"/old tire being brought in but supply of the other tire should have continued for the remainder of that season imo, something Dorna have I belive now recognised and made a rule concerning same.
3 Mid season tyre changes.

2008, 2012, 2017
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November 19th, 2019, 11:45 AM   #48
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Rossi said with his new team he has finally support from Yamaha. How nice. 2020 title to Rossi?
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November 19th, 2019, 12:14 PM   #49
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Quote:
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He needs to qualify better and have more tyre performance in the latter half of the race. The last 2 races have really shown what the Yamahas are like. They lack top speed so they have to start up the grid, get a great race start AND maintain tyre performance to get good results. They lack the top speed to work through to the front.

VR lacks qualifying performance and race long performance. I'm afraid that Sepang will likely be a one-off in his tyre performance longevity. I do feel that his lack of showing has a lot to do with his bike setup etc. He has shown that he can be there if the bike/tyres are up to it. But then he will continue to be on the backfoot, struggling with getting better than 4th places if he is 0.7-0.8 sec off the top qualifying pace. The young guns are thrashing him in that regard.
If he doesn’t have 1-2 lap pace for qualifying or race long pace, what have you got.? Rossi ‘s issue is his setup, he still believes he can win without riding the ragged edge and that’s just not possible in today’s GP where there are 8-10 bikes capable of winning instead of 4 and all on the same tire. Rossi really hasn’t slowed down, the competition has just left him behind.
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