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August 22nd, 2019, 12:25 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by povol View Post
Ago’s records are not the benchmark to me. He raced in an era when he had such bike advantages it didn’t take greatness to win. Twin cylinder factory bikes against single cylinder privateers in a lot of years skewed his numbers. What Doohan did was more impressive, then Rossi was more impressive than Doohan, and now what Marquez s doing is even more impressive because of the equality of the machinery. Rossi and Doohan got the majority of their wins when there was a huge talent dip either early or late stages of their careers. Marc has got all his wins against two of the best that have ever been and they are now fading as will Dovi, who can take wins on the best bike at Ducati tracks but can’t beat Marc for 19-20 race season. His window closed after 17 when he had by far the best bike and couldn’t get it done. The last couple of years, he has had a slightly better bike but is getting trounced. If there is a talent gap the next 5 years like Doohan and Rossi enjoyed, I see no reason why Marc can’t win 40 maybe 50 races in that time frame. The next wave of contenders such as Vinales, , Rins, Morbidelli, Bagnaia, etc all seem to be just a notch below and need favorable conditions to win races, much less championships. Quatararo could be the one to take it to Marc for an entire season but really hasn’t proven anything except that he has speed. How will he react to the pressures of “ HAVING “ to win or podium every race to contend with Marquez. He puts you under so much pressure to be damn near perfect that most just can’t handle . That’s when they start blaming their bike, the team, their personal trainer, their dog or whatever. That’s when you know they have broke. We will see, but I don’t see the guy out there at the moment in any class that’s going to be “ the “ one.
Exactly why I don't get into any discussions of comparisons between Hailwood or Agostini and modern racers. Hailwood was of his time and rightly considered a legend - to his generation. Moreover BTW - a lot of Hailwood's wins were time trials: one more reason why the guys who now dice it and duel each other at speeds Hailwood couldn't imagine, cannot be compared. His legend is not in any way diminished by the fact that he had great bikes. He used what was there.

Last edited by Keshav; August 22nd, 2019 at 12:31 PM.
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August 22nd, 2019, 09:53 PM   #12
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I would argue strongly that on the basis of competition and parity then Marquez is the GOAT if he wins again this year. Using the logic that’s Rossi>Ago because of machinery and competition then Marquez>Rossi is a no brainer.

Ago’s 122 wins might not be achievable because he raced in multiple classes at the same time but Rossi’s 89 premier class win record may be. Rossi fans will cling on to the 89 wins to argue his superiority until it is surpassed. If Marquez can rattle off another 5 wins this season then I’d be surprised if he doesn’t beat it at some stage. But if he (unlikely I know) only gets 1 or 2 wins for the rest of the season I think it becomes a lot harder. On his current form and with the current contract situation 15 wins till the end or 2020 is very possible IMO. After that it’s a question of where he goes, if he moves which I’m not sure he will and just how much talent Quatararo among others has.
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August 23rd, 2019, 08:09 AM   #13
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The other thing is that the seasons are getting longer with more and more races per season, making it that much easier to rack up the race wins before his peak is past.
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