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January 2nd, 2019, 05:22 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by evo9 View Post
fixed
Thank you. Yes, it was Tech Three. Quite a commitment by Dovi. C.C. had brake issues with them, too. I don't remember what he did about it.

Okay, now we have 2017 AND 2015.
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January 2nd, 2019, 08:40 PM   #12
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Dovi is awesome. Leave him alone. He and I will be good friends one day. We will talk about racing and he will teach me how to ride really really fast. I have it all planned.
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January 3rd, 2019, 03:50 AM   #13
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No - not true re: straight line advantage. He may have ridden that way to get to the front in races where he didn't quail well, but that only makes sense; best way to save tires till later in the race. Watch the last few races of the last two seasons. There was plenty of repeated take and re-take between him and Marquez, especially at Motegi in the rain: that was nuts.

Personally - I don't think falling is the same as "choking". Errors happen.

As to the faster bike thing, I've yet to see Marquez dominate a race on an inferior bike.
Nice to have sensible debates again, I've missed that. You make a good point regarding the straightline advantage but I still stand by my point. He isn't a fighter like Marquez. Look at Austria 2017. Most people would have mortgaged their house on Dovi running away with that, and Marquez frankly put his Honda in a position it shouldn't have been. I've yet to see Dovi able to demonstrate pushing to that level. Sure, as you say, he rides around the tyres but he has 0 championships in GP and Marquez has 5, the numbers don't lie.

Look at Austria 2018 too. When it came down to a tooth and nail fight it was the Ducati of Lorenzo, not Dovi, who took it to Marquez. What happened to Dovi? Again he outbraked himself and choked/made an error in turn 1. He has made too many mistakes under pressure imo. I'm not saying he isn't a great rider, they all are. But as I say he isn't in the league of riders like JL and MM.

I suppose as Iamapony said, 2015 is the best example of Marquez on an 'inferior' bike of which there are races he dominated, but the Dalligna Ducati's are hardly Aprilia's are they? Even the early ones.
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January 3rd, 2019, 03:51 AM   #14
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Dovi is awesome. Leave him alone. He and I will be good friends one day. We will talk about racing and he will teach me how to ride really really fast. I have it all planned.
Careful, you risk becoming the JonWolf of MotoGPforum!
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January 3rd, 2019, 04:55 AM   #15
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Nice to have sensible debates again, I've missed that. You make a good point regarding the straightline advantage but I still stand by my point. He isn't a fighter like Marquez. Look at Austria 2017. Most people would have mortgaged their house on Dovi running away with that, and Marquez frankly put his Honda in a position it shouldn't have been. I've yet to see Dovi able to demonstrate pushing to that level. Sure, as you say, he rides around the tyres but he has 0 championships in GP and Marquez has 5, the numbers don't lie.

Look at Austria 2018 too. When it came down to a tooth and nail fight it was the Ducati of Lorenzo, not Dovi, who took it to Marquez. What happened to Dovi? Again he outbraked himself and choked/made an error in turn 1. He has made too many mistakes under pressure imo. I'm not saying he isn't a great rider, they all are. But as I say he isn't in the league of riders like JL and MM.

I suppose as Iamapony said, 2015 is the best example of Marquez on an 'inferior' bike of which there are races he dominated, but the Dalligna Ducati's are hardly Aprilia's are they? Even the early ones.
I agree that Dovi seems to lack that extra strand of DNA that separates great riders from greatest riders. MM, Lorenzo and Rossi have it. Dovi, much as I like him seems destined to be the bridesmaid. Still as bridesmaids go, hes one of the more admirable ones. Beating Marquez more times than any other rider over the last three seasons is nothing to sneeze at.
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January 3rd, 2019, 05:06 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Keshav View Post
No - not true re: straight line advantage. He may have ridden that way to get to the front in races where he didn't quail well, but that only makes sense; best way to save tires till later in the race. Watch the last few races of the last two seasons. There was plenty of repeated take and re-take between him and Marquez, especially at Motegi in the rain: that was nuts.

Personally - I don't think falling is the same as "choking". Errors happen.

As to the faster bike thing, I've yet to see Marquez dominate a race on an inferior bike.
He dominated the 2016 and 2018 season on an inferior bike. In 16 Yamaha was better and 18 the Ducati was better.
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January 3rd, 2019, 11:39 AM   #17
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There's no shame in not being as good as Marc Marquez. He's, after all, one of the best ever. Dovi rides the Duke very, very well.
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January 3rd, 2019, 02:11 PM   #18
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He dominated the 2016 and 2018 season on an inferior bike. In 16 Yamaha was better and 18 the Ducati was better.
Now we're getting into semantics and hair-splitting. Reasonable minded people will I think agree that in those seasons the Yamaha and Ducati had measurable advantages in either set-up/handling or top speed but to call the Repsol bikes "inferior" is slipping into hyperbole territory. The KTM and Aprilias would be sufficient a downgrade as to be called inferior.
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January 3rd, 2019, 05:43 PM   #19
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Now we're getting into semantics and hair-splitting. Reasonable minded people will I think agree that in those seasons the Yamaha and Ducati had measurable advantages in either set-up/handling or top speed but to call the Repsol bikes "inferior" is slipping into hyperbole territory. The KTM and Aprilias would be sufficient a downgrade as to be called inferior.
By definition, the Honda was inferior . never did I say it was grossly inferior, or that the Ducati was outlandishly superior,but nonetheless the Ducati was the better bike and the championship was a rout. It simply cracks me up that he wants to share the blame with his team for his mistakes.
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January 4th, 2019, 05:30 AM   #20
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There's no shame in not being as good as Marc Marquez. He's, after all, one of the best ever. Dovi rides the Duke very, very well.
Well said. He does extract the strengths of it very well. In a way I'd have liked to see what Lorenzo could have done with it this season.

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By definition, the Honda was inferior . never did I say it was grossly inferior, or that the Ducati was outlandishly superior,but nonetheless the Ducati was the better bike and the championship was a rout. It simply cracks me up that he wants to share the blame with his team for his mistakes.
He was too engrossed in his contract negotiations early in the year and took his eye off the ball. With a rival like Marquez you cannot do that.
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