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September 24th, 2018, 04:11 AM   #91
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Awesome race. MM was riding with a lot of determination at his strongest track, and Dovi made it very hard for him. The battle was fantastic. MM would be extremely about the win, but the strength of the Ducatis is ominous for the upcoming season...MM must be thanking his lucky stars that Jorge is coming to HRC on a bike designed around MM.

The Suzukis were extremely impressive - both were at the front. I wonder what the Suzukis are doing right that the Yamahas aren't.

The Yamahas were abysmal. Zarco struggled to get points, MV was more than 20 seconds back (though he should've been closer to his teammate) and Rossi was the top Yamaha in 9th. Krops had some interesting info in his post-Friday round-up about the lack of new parts since Tsuji took over from Nakajima as the head of Yamaha. It reminds me of HRC pre-Nakamoto.
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Last edited by RCV600RR; September 24th, 2018 at 04:17 AM.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:15 AM   #92
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On one hand, Yamaha's poor results are because Rossi can't develop a bike. On the other hand, Yamaha's good results in the past had nothing to do with Rossi's development skills.

The logic here is amusing.
At one time they had a guy called Furusawa. And a guy called Burgess although his influence may have been over-rated.

I think it is actually simultaneously possible for Rossi to have given good direction in his pomp and not so good now pushing 40 and set in his ways, although I also suspect engineering resources/budget relative to Honda and Ducati may be the most important factor.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:29 AM   #93
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Agreed. He makes it quite difficult to be a fan at times!! And now he's really going to start some "waaa you spoiled my race" nonsense mere months before becoming team mates! sigh...
Didn't see the first lap live, have seen it now. MM actually did take him wide, but as Jorge said himself he decided he didn't want to lose 5 or 6 places, which basically means to me he did elect to take a risk. He has made the first corner ahead himself from further back than second, so he really can't complain if someone for once jumps him at the start, and could have expected MM would be particularly keen to not let him reach the first corner ahead and disappear into the distance in Spain after several races of Ducati domination. If he was making a distinction between a judgement error and a straight riding error he might have more of a point.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:36 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCV600RR View Post
On one hand, Yamaha's poor results are because Rossi can't develop a bike. On the other hand, Yamaha's good results in the past had nothing to do with Rossi's development skills.

The logic here is amusing.
Rossi and Burgess did an amazing job of developing the Yamaha and turning the team around when he came over from Honda right through to when he left in 2010. Lorenzo also did an awesome job after Rossi left right though to his Ducati departure winning the 2012 and 2015 championships with the bike.

I dont know who the current lead feedback/development rider is at Yamaha, but they are either giving the engineers some really poor information or the engineers simply aren't listening. I get the feeling that Yamaha have been ultra conservative with updating their bikes in the last few years. They've had the strongest bike for a very long time and got too comfortable and complacent, dropping the ball.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:44 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCV600RR View Post
On one hand, Yamaha's poor results are because Rossi can't develop a bike. On the other hand, Yamaha's good results in the past had nothing to do with Rossi's development skills.

The logic here is amusing.
I know right.

And that one moron taking a swing at Yamaha’s paint schemes. Has he ever heard of Repsol Honda?
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September 24th, 2018, 04:48 AM   #96
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Rossi said very plainly that he has no idea what the factory is preparing. Those without an agenda can infer from that that they simply aren’t listening to the riders. He also said that he is not an engineer, his job is not to say if they need a V engine or an inline engine, just to relay feedback, which is in direct contradiction to some of the tinfoil theories posted here.

Here is the fact of the matter: Cal Fucking Crutchlow is faster than every Yamaha including Rossi now. If anyone thinks that this is because he is a better rider than Rossi, I have a bridge to sell to them.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:52 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
At one time they had a guy called Furusawa. And a guy called Burgess although his influence may have been over-rated.

I think it is actually simultaneously possible for Rossi to have given good direction in his pomp and not so good now pushing 40 and set in his ways, although I also suspect engineering resources/budget relative to Honda and Ducati may be the most important factor.
Nakajima was also very good.

Rossi was the only one of the Yamaha riders that said the development direction and updates were wrong and ineffective all the way back at Valencia 2016. Zarco and MV (after a lot of kilometers, time and testing) all came to agree with him. I recall Zarco dismissively saying that the 2017 M1 had a better chassis than the 2016 M1 concept...then on the last day of winter testing, concluding that Rossi was actually right.

I agree that it's possible, but the intuitive conclusion is that his development skills would've only improved after having raced every bike and tyre configuration under the sun.
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September 24th, 2018, 04:57 AM   #98
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I got me a pair of those recently. Brilliant.
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September 24th, 2018, 05:00 AM   #99
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Rossi and Burgess did an amazing job of developing the Yamaha and turning the team around when he came over from Honda right through to when he left in 2010. Lorenzo also did an awesome job after Rossi left right though to his Ducati departure winning the 2012 and 2015 championships with the bike.

I dont know who the current lead feedback/development rider is at Yamaha, but they are either giving the engineers some really poor information or the engineers simply aren't listening. I get the feeling that Yamaha have been ultra conservative with updating their bikes in the last few years. They've had the strongest bike for a very long time and got too comfortable and complacent, dropping the ball.
They show strong signs of being cash strapped to me, and seem to have struggled to attract sponsorship independent of Rossi for years, hence going with Rossi nearing the age of 40, Petronas in the offing perhaps attracted by Rossi, etc.

They risk it all falling apart, including Rossi himself becoming discontented , if they can't finish better than 8th, which it is extremely likely would have been 9th without Jorge's first corner mishap.
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September 24th, 2018, 05:06 AM   #100
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They show strong signs of being cash strapped to me, and seem to have struggled to attract sponsorship independent of Rossi for years, hence going with Rossi nearing the age of 40, Petronas in the offing perhaps attracted by Rossi, etc.

They risk it all falling apart, including Rossi himself becoming discontented , if they can't finish better than 8th, which it is extremely likely would have been 9th without Jorge's first corner mishap.
Yamaha is not cash strapped as a company.

The difference is that HRC and Ducati Corse are independent entities that get their own budget and roadmaps and can do whatever they want with it while Yamaha racing is just a part of their European division and do not have anywhere close to the autonomous freedom the other two enjoy.

This is in many ways similar to what’s happening with the WSBK effort from Honda.
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