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June 19th, 2018, 09:13 AM   #221
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Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
I agree. It has always mostly been about tires for Jorge, and my hypothesis has been either he has learnt to ride the Ducati to preserve the tires better, or they have done something with the bike in that regard. He has had fairly good 1 lap pace and early race pace not infrequently for a while.
Here, a (this time sober) article by Mat that indeed focuses on the Michelin front tire, braking and the famous new tank to explain Lorenzo's dramatic switch in performance: https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/o...orenzo-winning

BTW, Dall'Igna said that the current one is the 20th something custom tank they made for Jorge.
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June 19th, 2018, 11:15 AM   #222
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It's interesting to read the pendulum swing, just a few weeks ago Lorenzo was the Viņalez of GP, and now Dovi is the Barbara of Ducati, apparently. I'm reminded of Dinah Washington's rendition of 'What a difference a day makes...'

20 iterations of a tank change, and this one was the Excalibur? I'm not so sure, but I'm inclined to think the Excalibur has a "Made in France" label. When did soft tires become the race distance preference?

It's also fascinating to read some of the same peeps giving Dovi grief for trying win it by risking pace whilst giving Marc a pass when crashing or saying Rossi is points collecting, though when Marc does it, it's genius particularly when he saves a crash, and Rossi is chicken for not risking pace. Dovi is going for broke, sometimes it doesn't work out, he's not one with the reputation for putting it all on the line according to these detractors, so when he does he's the worst person in the world? Also, when did this notion he is a diva become the narrative? And I'll add in the context that there were so many crashers that finishing the race guaranteed points. Is there something there there?

So what's going on with Zarco? He's looking like Lorenzo a month ago, Viņalez currently. The ebbs and flows of tire manipulation? Or has developed caught up to the year old bike?

The current tire iterations, where the soft is working over a race distance for Lorenzo on a Ducati should have a clear effect when Lorenzo is running the RCV that seems to demand, seemingly require, a harder tire. It will be interesting to see how it pans out. Also, I don't think it's out of the realm of possibly for Lorenzo to mount a championship run thanks this dynamic, including another possible Marc DNF which is always just a Michelin front tire away.

If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
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Last edited by Jumkie; June 19th, 2018 at 11:29 AM.
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June 19th, 2018, 12:19 PM   #223
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Originally Posted by J4rn0 View Post
Here, a (this time sober) article by Mat that indeed focuses on the Michelin front tire, braking and the famous new tank to explain Lorenzo's dramatic switch in performance: https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/o...orenzo-winning

BTW, Dall'Igna said that the current one is the 20th something custom tank they made for Jorge.
Wow, more than 20 tanks! So JL's claims of his tank requests being ignored are misleading.
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June 19th, 2018, 12:26 PM   #224
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It does appear that Ducati was not tanking George on purpose!
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June 19th, 2018, 12:34 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by J4rn0 View Post
.....
BTW, Dall'Igna said that the current one is the 20th something custom tank they made for Jorge.
I can't seem to find this information. Could you provide a link, please?

Excuse my incredulous doubt that they had made twenty tanks, when Jorge had only been there for twenty-three races at the time.
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June 19th, 2018, 12:36 PM   #226
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I can't seem to find this information. Could you provide a link, please?

Excuse my incredulous doubt that they had made twenty tanks, when Jorge had only been there for twenty-three races at the time.
No reason they could not have tried multiple tanks in the course of a weekend, to say nothing of days where they were doing testing. J4rno has always been reliable when it comes to sources quoted. A native Italian speaker, he's privy to sources we don't have access to.
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June 19th, 2018, 01:21 PM   #227
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I can't seem to find this information. Could you provide a link, please?

Excuse my incredulous doubt that they had made twenty tanks, when Jorge had only been there for twenty-three races at the time.
I hear many things that often are not online, but this one has just been published so if you read Italian follow this link: https://www.moto.it/MotoGP/motogp-da...n-lorenzo.html
A very interesting itw with Gigi after Mugello. Says many other things besides the tank comment.
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June 19th, 2018, 02:12 PM   #228
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Zarco's form of late is explained by him and his team heading for KTM. It won't get better.
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June 19th, 2018, 02:56 PM   #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumkie View Post
It's interesting to read the pendulum swing, just a few weeks ago Lorenzo was the Viņalez of GP, and now Dovi is the Barbara of Ducati, apparently. I'm reminded of Dinah Washington's rendition of 'What a difference a day makes...'

20 iterations of a tank change, and this one was the Excalibur? I'm not so sure, but I'm inclined to think the Excalibur has a "Made in France" label. When did soft tires become the race distance preference?

It's also fascinating to read some of the same peeps giving Dovi grief for trying win it by risking pace whilst giving Marc a pass when crashing or saying Rossi is points collecting, though when Marc does it, it's genius particularly when he saves a crash, and Rossi is chicken for not risking pace. Dovi is going for broke, sometimes it doesn't work out, he's not one with the reputation for putting it all on the line according to these detractors, so when he does he's the worst person in the world? Also, when did this notion he is a diva become the narrative? And I'll add in the context that there were so many crashers that finishing the race guaranteed points. Is there something there there?

So what's going on with Zarco? He's looking like Lorenzo a month ago, Viņalez currently. The ebbs and flows of tire manipulation? Or has developed caught up to the year old bike?

3?0utcThe current tire iterations, where the soft is working over a race distance for Lorenzo on a Ducati should have a clear effect when Lorenzo is running the RCV that seems to demand, seemingly require, a harder tire. It will be interesting to see how it pans out. Also, I don't think it's out of the realm of possibly for Lorenzo to mount a championship run thanks this dynamic, including another possible Marc DNF which is always just a Michelin front tire away.

3?
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
I agree, and have said myself, that something with a Bibendum
label on it is very likely contributing to Jorge’s resurgence, and if I am to don my tinfoil hat it is interesting that his improvement followed Uncle Carmelo’s endorsement of him; as you know I think they all should have tires which suit them btw.


I think Rossi is doing about as well as he can given his unhappiness with the current bike and tires. Zarco’s drop in performance was fairly predictable, and was in fact predicted by a number of posters. Syahrin on the other hand is improving his pace, and obviously that is down to him and all credit to him, but as opposed to Zarco he may also be a future Petronas Yamaha rider.

Whichever way you cut it Dovi can’t dnf 3 races out of 4 and expect to challenge for the championship, 2 solo riding errors and 1 which while not primarily his fault involved an over optimistic pass; at the time it looked like Lorenzo was being too combative given his seemingly inevitable late race decline, but subsequent events have shown he was perhaps on the cusp of lasting race distance. MM wasn’t given a free pass when he was dnfing at a championship killing rate in 2015, and I believe can be allowed one dnf at least due to a riding error per year. Dovi does not seem to have the same approach as last year when he bided his time and came on strong late race; perhaps circumstances have changed this year and demand a different approach, but that he has made a somewhat desperate pass on Lorenzo and dnfed with Lorenzo steaming away in the lead makes it hard for me at least to dismiss Lorenzo as a factor.
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June 19th, 2018, 03:08 PM   #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
I agree, and have said myself, that something with a Bibendum
label on it is very likely contributing to Jorge’s resurgence, and if I am to don my tinfoil hat it is interesting that his improvement followed Uncle Carmelo’s endorsement of him; as you know I think they all should have tires which suit them btw.


I think Rossi is doing about as well as he can given his unhappiness with the current bike and tires. Zarco’s drop in performance was fairly predictable, and was in fact predicted by a number of posters. Syahrin on the other hand is improving his pace, and obviously that is down to him and all credit to him, but as opposed to Zarco he may also be a future Petronas Yamaha rider.

Whichever way you cut it Dovi can’t dnf 3 races out of 4 and expect to challenge for the championship, 2 solo riding errors and 1 which while not primarily his fault involved an over optimistic pass; at the time it looked like Lorenzo was being too combative given his seemingly inevitable late race decline, but subsequent events have shown he was perhaps on the cusp of lasting race distance. MM wasn’t given a free pass when he was dnfing at a championship killing rate in 2015, and I believe can be allowed one dnf at least due to a riding error per year. Dovi does not seem to have the same approach as last year when he bided his time and came on strong late race; perhaps circumstances have changed this year and demand a different approach, but that he has made a somewhat desperate pass on Lorenzo and dnfed with Lorenzo steaming away in the lead makes it hard for me at least to dismiss Lorenzo as a factor.
Maybe too obvious, but circumstances have changed, in that the RCV is more competitive this year, Dovi is being paid more which has to create pressure and it would be reasonable to assume, being in close proximity to Lorenzo all the time, Dovi would be seeing signs that Lorenzo was on the verge of a breakthrough. Of course, it could all be down to... tires. I'm thinking that this is one of those times when the most glaringly plausible answer, is the right one.

Last edited by Keshav; June 19th, 2018 at 03:46 PM.
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