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May 18th, 2018, 10:07 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
Both the moves by multiple world title winning Yamaha riders to Ducati were about status in the team.

I also don't think the tire change would have happened last year if the 'new' tire hadn't been Rossi's preferred tire. That is what would annoy me were I was Vinales, that the bike and tire were good for him when he got there, serendipitously no doubt, and Yamaha didn't even fight to keep the old tire along with the new one, which it is now recognised by a regulation is what should have happened.
Please stop this new tyre narrative.
Vinales straight up admitted by middle of last year that the chassis he picked after the tests was a dud as Rossi said , which was not apparent at the start of the season and only became apparent in the euro rounds.

Both riders were in complete agreement on what things were wrong 2/3rds into the season.

Every time this story is brought up, someone sets the record straight and a few weeks later, it starts all over again.
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May 18th, 2018, 10:09 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synn View Post
Yamaha does not have a number 1 and 2 riders.
Both get the same equipment and support, there are no clauses that stop them from fighting each other on track and the engine spec is frozen only after both riders agree on it.
The Jarvis clause.

You may not see it written anywhere, but it exists.
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May 18th, 2018, 10:11 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPSLotus View Post
When Rossi and Lorenzo were offered 2 year deals for the 17-18 seasons, it was reported they were identical. Kind of pathetic given Lorenzo was coming off a world title and Rossi was not.
True, but the world revolves around earning potential and brand awareness, which sadly Lorenzo does not have by comparison to Rossi.

People will still be buying VR46 merchandise long after he has retired whilst Lorenzo will be thought of as a former champion only ............ sad reality I am afraid

Last edited by Gaz; May 18th, 2018 at 10:16 PM.
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May 18th, 2018, 10:14 PM   #54
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Even J.Lo doesn’t buy J.Lo merchandise.
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May 18th, 2018, 10:47 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synn View Post
Please stop this new tyre narrative.
Vinales straight up admitted by middle of last year that the chassis he picked after the tests was a dud as Rossi said , which was not apparent at the start of the season and only became apparent in the euro rounds.

Both riders were in complete agreement on what things were wrong 2/3rds into the season.

Every time this story is brought up, someone sets the record straight and a few weeks later, it starts all over again.
Your narrative and mine seem to be at variance, which doesn't mean either of us is correct, or exclude both of us being wrong, of course.

In my narrative Vinales, after being at the pointy end of the field on the "old" tire in preseason testing had 3 wins, a 4th and a 2nd to go along with 1 dnf in the first 6 races of the season (the 2nd placing coming at Mugello, his last race on the original tire), was one of three riders who voted for the original tire to continue, and a regulation was promulgated post-season that no mid-season tire removal was to occur in future. If you can demonstrate to me those things didn't actually occur, I would consider changing my narrative.
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May 18th, 2018, 11:32 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
Your narrative and mine seem to be at variance, which doesn't mean either of us is correct, or exclude both of us being wrong, of course.

In my narrative Vinales, after being at the pointy end of the field on the "old" tire in preseason testing had 3 wins, a 4th and a 2nd to go along with 1 dnf in the first 6 races of the season (the 2nd placing coming at Mugello, his last race on the original tire), was one of three riders who voted for the original tire to continue, and a regulation was promulgated post-season that no mid-season tire removal was to occur in future. If you can demonstrate to me those things didn't actually occur, I would consider changing my narrative.
Not sure that fits the end goal of synns narative though. it doesnt make rossi look good
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May 18th, 2018, 11:38 PM   #57
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I'm pretty sure Mugello was actually the first race with the new tyre.

Also in regards to Vinales now admitting there was a mistake with the chassis, at the time he was adamant the bike was fine, it was the tyres. Then the results dropped when Rossi got the chassis he wanted which caused them to make another chassis which didn't improve things. Vinales would be expected to toe the company line and say that the original chassis that they went away from was the wrong choice rather than making his team look like morons after they discarded what was in his opinion a perfectly good chassis. He was also denied the chance to run his preferred chassis and had to run the newer versions of the chassis.

In regards to the tyre change, I am of the opinion that the original tyre was very troublesome given the amount of 'unexplained' crashes where riders would come back and say that the data showed no difference from the previous lap in where they braked etc.
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May 18th, 2018, 11:41 PM   #58
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Lets face it Vinales could not be beaten by rossi when he first came to Yam. rossi could do only one thing ... try and changevthe situation.
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May 18th, 2018, 11:59 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p4p1 View Post
I'm pretty sure Mugello was actually the first race with the new tyre.

Also in regards to Vinales now admitting there was a mistake with the chassis, at the time he was adamant the bike was fine, it was the tyres. Then the results dropped when Rossi got the chassis he wanted which caused them to make another chassis which didn't improve things. Vinales would be expected to toe the company line and say that the original chassis that they went away from was the wrong choice rather than making his team look like morons after they discarded what was in his opinion a perfectly good chassis. He was also denied the chance to run his preferred chassis and had to run the newer versions of the chassis.

In regards to the tyre change, I am of the opinion that the original tyre was very troublesome given the amount of 'unexplained' crashes where riders would come back and say that the data showed no difference from the previous lap in where they braked etc.
I had no problem with them changing the tire, I just believe the old one should have continued as well as has since been acknowledged by regulation. I also think, perhaps like Jumkie, that mid-season rider tire votes while having the appearance of democracy give an opportunity to handicap riders ahead in the title race, and coincidentally or not both such rider tire votes in the last decade have been to the detriment of the rider leading the points at the time. Last year we also had the strange occurrence that most of the riders were apparently unaware that the new/old tire was being brought to the Americas for testing. The end result even if the Yamaha chassis was suboptimal was to probably disadvantage Vinales who went to the early championship lead on the old tire, and definitely advantage MM whom the original tire did not suit as well.

You are I believe correct that the new tire came in at Mugello rather than after Mugello.

Last edited by michaelm; May 19th, 2018 at 05:41 AM.
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May 19th, 2018, 12:07 AM   #60
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Commentary Team says current rumors are J.Lo or Joan Mir to Suzuki and Iannone to Aprilia
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