MotoGP Forum  

Go Back   MotoGP Forum > MotoGP Forum > MotoGP

MotoGP MotoGP Forum - MotoGP Class Motorcycle Racing Forum


Like Tree142Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
May 18th, 2018, 10:52 AM   #31
Senior Member
 
Joined: Feb 2015
From: Southport England

Posts: 1,328
Likes: 638

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumkie View Post
Agree. He may be unhappy, but he isn't going anywhere. That seat is simply too good. As good as Suzuki 'may become' it will still have to compete with the factory Yamaha and Honda.

Remembering Hopkins kicked his Suckzuki, sure, agree, they all look dissatisfied when their bikes are not working, but there is an observable degree of difference in their outward behavior by riders that can be distinguished and how much they are willing to throw their employer under the bus. Here's look at you Cuntwhore...

Lorenzo is the only one I see looking at Suzuki as his Savior. Meanwhile I'm enjoying his Ducati shit show. (Though I will say, he probably has a win or a podium coming at somepoint in the season this year on a Marc/Dovi off day).
Depends on the situation, I said this to people regarding the Yamaha-Dunlop defection at TT 2015. When you employ a motorcycle racer to get results the employer needs to provide a machine capable of doing so, it's a two way deal and Yamaha didn't uphold their end of the bargain in that situation which led to a star rider taking the unprecedented action of walking out of one team and into another one during the same meeting and as much as Michael was shit on he was justified in his performances.
BarryMachine, Gaz and Theo like this.
AntG is offline  
 
May 18th, 2018, 11:22 AM   #32
Senior Member
 
Jumkie's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2006
From: Your Mom's House

Posts: 24,726
Likes: 3980

Quote:
Originally Posted by AntG View Post
Depends on the situation, I said this to people regarding the Yamaha-Dunlop defection at TT 2015. When you employ a motorcycle racer to get results the employer needs to provide a machine capable of doing so, it's a two way deal and Yamaha didn't uphold their end of the bargain in that situation which led to a star rider taking the unprecedented action of walking out of one team and into another one during the same meeting and as much as Michael was shit on he was justified in his performances.
I agree that there is an agreement between rider and factory (if you're a factory branded rider, satellites riders must operate under a different dynamic) that the factory needs to deliver a competitive machine whilst the rider agrees to ride it to the limit. But some factories are not either willing or capable of it, take for example KTM and Aprillia, they’re trying but are way behind the experience and resources of Honda and Yamaha. Suzuki I think are simply unwilling to put in the balls to the wall effort required to compete with Honda and Yamaha.

In regards to Hopkins, I don’t think we can say he didn’t put his dick on the line to get everything out of his machines, that includes his rookie year. This has left his body quite broken. In this case, I think his employers (Kawasaki and Suzuki GP) let him down. I know you are a Cal Crutchlow fan (and you know I am not, believe me, I cringe knowing my friend Arrabi reads my posts) but the thought that I had as I wrote my post was him talking smack about his RCV when he was interviewed after he had just got the pole position. I felt it was ungracious in the extreme, I mean come on man, you’re on pole position, don’t ruin the moment by saying Honda are costing you time because you’re ‘rightfully’ testing parts. Sure, I don’t mind these guys talking about the deficiencies of the machines when they obviously don’t think they’re to blame, but some of these guys go way overboard, some weaponizing the media not so much to put pressure on their employer but rather to clear themselves of their shortcomings. Rossi is good at doing this for example. Dovi and Hayden were too docile to hold their employer’s accountable.

Marquez was vocal about the power delivery of the previous engine, and this was backed up by Pedrosa and Crutchlow. So I agree, these guys should be free to express themselves about the machine’s shortcomings, but I think there is a distinction between doing this and whining. It’s a fine line, no doubt, and there may be other factors at play. For example, recently the electronics have become a Yamaha talking point, well, unless Yamaha are not privy to what’s going on at Tech3, I don’t see how this can be such a blind spot for the factory given Zarco’s performance, granted he is on a different chassis, but we are talking electronics. Therefore, what’s wrong with the “new” package that the “old” package is doing better? Another thing to consider is this, I remember talking to a Moto2 tech (one of those paddock guys that I recently hosted on a visit to my area) who said sometimes the factories don’t use the better solution because of an agreement with a vendor to use the “newest” product, and so the team struggles to make the new part work knowing damn well the previous model was superior. It comes down to a marketing pressure, the vendor (or factory) have made a “new” product and have spent a large budget to market it. No way are they going to say, ooops we screwed up, the older model is better. That is why when the factory guys want to use a previous chassis/swing arm for example, its not just a question of performance, there is pressure by the rider because he wants to go faster, but there is pressure from the standpoint of the factory that has a reputation to uphold, and they would look stupid that their "new" stuff is shit. The message being they're not progressing normally. I’ve seen this happens with suspension components. So there are probably many layers to this dynamic that we as spectators are not privy.
JPSLotus likes this.

Last edited by Jumkie; May 18th, 2018 at 11:28 AM.
Jumkie is offline  
May 18th, 2018, 11:27 AM   #33
Senior Member
 
Holypuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2018
From: Italy

Posts: 510
Likes: 419

I Ride: Honda CRF250 (modified for Dirt Track)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryMachine View Post
Stands to reason ..... the only rider who has seemed to be "ok" with being on rossis team was edwards, and he seemed happy just to collect the salary. I cant see a young bloke like Vinales just being there for the money and if he is being hindered to play second fiddle to rossi .... then yeah he'd be pissed.

The offer that Suzuki made to Maverick at the end of 2016 to convince him to stay was better than the one he had from Yamaha.

He chose Yamaha because he wanted to aim to a World Title which, I reckon, he would 100% be able to do if he could get back to the comfort with the bike that he had in the first tests/races. But he can't, and that is the issue.
Holypuck is online now  
May 18th, 2018, 11:30 AM   #34
Senior Member
 
Holypuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2018
From: Italy

Posts: 510
Likes: 419

I Ride: Honda CRF250 (modified for Dirt Track)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4p1 View Post
He could be using something like this as a bargaining chip with Yamaha. He threatens something like this and forces Yamaha to commit to him as their number 1 rider?

I don't think so. He already has a signed contract and a set deal, that he would indeed have to break.

And mate, no one will ever be Yamaha's number 1 until Rossi is there.
Holypuck is online now  
May 18th, 2018, 11:31 AM   #35
Senior Member
 
Jumkie's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2006
From: Your Mom's House

Posts: 24,726
Likes: 3980

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holypuck View Post
The offer that Suzuki made to Maverick at the end of 2016 to convince him to stay was better than the one he had from Yamaha.

He chose Yamaha because he wanted to aim to a World Title which, I reckon, he would 100% be able to do if he could get back to the comfort with the bike that he had in the first tests/races. But he can't, and that is the issue.
He had a sweat spot at the start of last year, then democracy.
Jumkie is offline  
May 18th, 2018, 11:33 AM   #36
Senior Member
 
Holypuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2018
From: Italy

Posts: 510
Likes: 419

I Ride: Honda CRF250 (modified for Dirt Track)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumkie View Post
He had a sweat spot at the start of last year, then democracy.

He is still blazing fast when he gets the bike at a level that is decent for him.

I'm nowhere near a Vinales fan so I have no interest in "defending" him, but credit where is due. He is one talented kid.
Holypuck is online now  
May 18th, 2018, 11:35 AM   #37
Senior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2017
From: Earth

Posts: 1,756
Likes: 713

I Ride: Your mom on most days.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holypuck View Post
I don't think so. He already has a signed contract and a set deal, that he would indeed have to break.

And mate, no one will ever be Yamaha's number 1 until Rossi is there.
Yamaha does not have a number 1 and 2 riders.
Both get the same equipment and support, there are no clauses that stop them from fighting each other on track and the engine spec is frozen only after both riders agree on it.
synn is offline  
May 18th, 2018, 11:43 AM   #38
Senior Member
 
Holypuck's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2018
From: Italy

Posts: 510
Likes: 419

I Ride: Honda CRF250 (modified for Dirt Track)
Quote:
Originally Posted by synn View Post
Yamaha does not have a number 1 and 2 riders.
Both get the same equipment and support, there are no clauses that stop them from fighting each other on track and the engine spec is frozen only after both riders agree on it.
I agree. However that is not what I meant.

We must not forget how important psychology can be for a rider (well for any athlete, really) and almost anyone would feel a bit "inferior" in the Yamaha box due to Rossi's immense exposure, and no one really likes that. This is really not Rossi's fault so I'm not blaming him (for once ) but is just undeniable IMHO.
Holypuck is online now  
May 18th, 2018, 12:27 PM   #39
Senior Member
 
Hollywood's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2013
From: USA

Posts: 482
Likes: 162

FP2 ended with 5 different manufactures in the top 10, Suzuki was the only manufacture that missed out, 14th was as close as they got.
Hollywood is offline  
May 18th, 2018, 01:05 PM   #40
Senior Member
 
Theo's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2015
From: Chertsey, Surrey, UK

Posts: 1,522
Likes: 289

I Ride: A bicycle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holypuck View Post
I don't think so. He already has a signed contract and a set deal, that he would indeed have to break.

And mate, no one will ever be Yamaha's number 1 until Rossi is there.
When the pensioner went back to Yamahahahahaha, he was number 2.
Theo is offline  
Reply

  MotoGP Forum > MotoGP Forum > MotoGP

Tags
heard, thing, vinales, weird



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Weird stuff in Tavullia Pigeon MotoGP 8 September 2nd, 2010 11:36 AM
Has anyone heard? rainbowsky MotoGP 1 June 19th, 2006 04:23 AM


Facebook Twitter Google+ RSS Feed



Copyright © 2005-2018 Powerslide. All rights reserved.
MotoGP Forum is a MotoGP enthusiast's forum, but it is in no way affiliated with, nor does it represent MotoGP or Dorna Sports, S.L. of Madrid, Spain.