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October 6th, 2011, 03:21 PM   #1
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"Stoner could easily surpass what I've done, and perhaps even Valentino Rossi" – Mick Doohan.



Mick has offered his opinion on whether Casey Stoner can continue winning and surpass his own and Valentino Rossis Premiere class win records.



Personally I dont agree with Mick on this point for one important reason.....I just dont think Casey will hang around long enough to do so....he might break Doohans records but as for Valentinos I just think he has racked up too many wins over the years to be challenged...especially with the quality of opposition around at the moment.



I reckon if Casey wins another few championships he will call it a day and retire to the farm with the wife and kid(s) knowing he doesnt need to prove a thing about his riding....most people understand statistics need to have context applied for any value as a guide to performance.....I would think having consistently beaten Rossi on inferior equipment (as this year has shown beyond any doubt) this probably means more to him than outright win tallies.



Anyway Mick....true GOAT and legend of the sport. I reckon you are wrong
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October 6th, 2011, 03:42 PM   #2
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Well Mick had it much easier than Rossi or Stoner. Mick basically only had to beat his soft teammate. Not even the other "works" Hondas were on par. I also doubt Stoner will stick around for long. Once he has his kid he might just quit and go fishing.
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October 6th, 2011, 04:11 PM   #3
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I think it's possible but not a great bet with things constantly changing in gp, the playing feild will be more even next year though with the engines all producing about the same hp thanks to the rev limit and fuel rules. People are forgetting that Jlo is no slouch and if he had more hp he probably gets a couple more wins this year. I think Casey is faster at more tracks but no doubt jlo sneaks a few in. There is also no telling what the final tire for next year will be like with BS saying the tires are still in development just like the bikes. Next year should be pretty interesting, Honda may start the year with a nice advantage thanks to their low pressure direct injection but the others will jump on the DI bandwagon if it turns out to be worth it.
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October 6th, 2011, 04:17 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumkie View Post
Well Mick had it much easier than Rossi or Stoner. Mick basically only had to beat his soft teammate. Not even the other "works" Hondas were on par. I also doubt Stoner will stick around for long. Once he has his kid he might just quit and go fishing.


I understand you are on a fishing expedition here as you do love a good shit stir but there is SOME truth to what you say. So lets disect what you have stated......



Well Mick had it much easier than Rossi or Stoner.



Not at the start of his career he didnt....during his period of domination - yes. But Doohan was beating exactly the same guys Rossi dealt with during his golden years - so he must have found it "easy" too. Doohan suffered a very bad leg injury and came back from the brink to dominate.... look what has happened to Rossi after breaking his leg. Not exactly the same comeback but that is because Rossi now has very stiff competition - he has only 2 championships since 2006 because of it.



Mick basically only had to beat his soft teammate.



This suggests there were only 2 riders competing in the championship...we all know that IS a crap statement.



Not even the other "works" Hondas were on par.



You obviously have access to a source of information I dont, because my recollection was he had equal equipment to pretty well all his team mates which included Gardner, Lawson, Barros, Beattie, Okada and Criville. Some of them also used to get his setup data at times after they had difficulty setting up their own bikes - hardly fair to him but all part of the game.



Quite probably Doohan had first dibs on any new go fast bits...it has always been like this, but in many instances Doohan rejected these parts and refined the package he already had. If you mean 1997 when he was the sole rider who rode the NSR500 screamer you are correct....but this was due to the other works riders (Okada and Criville) rejecting them because of fear....Doohan always said it was psychological more than a bike advantage as to why he chose the screamer.



Nice try Jumks but no biscuit
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October 6th, 2011, 04:20 PM   #5
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i love Mick but he is full of shit i got $1000 says CS dont pull off 5 in a row
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October 6th, 2011, 04:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkdriver View Post
I think it's possible but not a great bet with things constantly changing in gp, the playing feild will be more even next year though with the engines all producing about the same hp thanks to the rev limit and fuel rules. People are forgetting that Jlo is no slouch and if he had more hp he probably gets a couple more wins this year. I think Casey is faster at more tracks but no doubt jlo sneaks a few in. There is also no telling what the final tire for next year will be like with BS saying the tires are still in development just like the bikes. Next year should be pretty interesting, Honda may start the year with a nice advantage thanks to their low pressure direct injection but the others will jump on the DI bandwagon if it turns out to be worth it.


Hey hawk...I didnt realise they were introducing a rev limit next year.....more dumbing down of the formula.



Any links to this rule change?



TIA.
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October 6th, 2011, 04:22 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xx CURVE xx View Post
mick is full of shit
Thats what i said except in a nicer way
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October 6th, 2011, 04:35 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Squiggle View Post
Hey hawk...I didnt realise they were introducing a rev limit next year.....more dumbing down of the formula.



Any links to this rule change?



TIA.
Are they going to use valve springs or pneumatics on the 1000's?



http://motomatters.com/news/2009/12/...ylinders_.html
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October 6th, 2011, 04:47 PM   #9
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I don't see Casey besting Rossi in this case. I think he's more talented than Rossi but not necessarily a better racer. Five more titles for Casey? I also don't think he'll stick around long enough to pull that off. I think the Yamaha will be better next season and Casey will have to push very hard to consistently beat Lorenzo, Speez and Dani. Throw in a little Sic once in a while and the race at the front looks to be a great deal more difficult. Casey will win his fair share but winning another 5 titles will take an extreme amount of patience and perseverance. I think Rossi had both and still does.



Casey has not demonstrated that capability...yet! He may but that's a big ask. I'd like to see it but in think speaking of it now is certainly premature.
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October 6th, 2011, 05:22 PM   #10
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Casey is only there proving things to himself. Once he is done or has satisfied his desire to race and achieve you will find him in a fishing or bow hunting magazine before AMCN.



I really don't think records mean diddly squat to him, unlike so many others.



A shame, he will (IMO) retire what most of us will judge to be prematurely.
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