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November 25th, 2010, 02:16 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Talpa View Post
Yes, and dually noted that the debate as to how Nicky got the official factory ride on the best bike in the world next to Rossi in the first place doesn't seem to come up much, especially with the conspiracy champions that exist here, probably the biggest back room deal ever............
I don't quite follow your line of argument; I don't see how the existence of a conspiracy to favour nicky hayden would make a conspiracy/conspiracies to favour valentino rossi less likely, not that I am arguing the latter on this thread at least.



As johnny has already posted hayden didn't exactly come from nowhere, he was the reigning ama championship, and signing ama champions has resulted in some success historically, including nicky's recruitment actually since as I recall nicky won a world championship for honda, their only one in the last 7 years. Perhaps honda should ask dorna to foist more riders on them. I think nicky also had strong backing from american honda, with the usa being an important market.



There is no need to invoke back room deals where dorna is concerned in this context anyway, since they very openly try to influence the national variety on the grid ; they partially funded stoner's entry into motogp with lcr in 2006.
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November 25th, 2010, 04:42 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by johnnyvvc View Post
You are wrong here Frizz!!



Firstly Rossi changed tyres at the end of the season when he just got his arse handed to him with no increrase in performance likely so no way to win, there is nothing wrong with that!

So you would stay on equipment that you had no chance of winning on would you, either a fool or a liar me thinks.



I agree that just like Pedrosa he used his influence to get what he wanted but he is a competitor just like them all, they all want to win & to do so they need the equipement to enable them to win.



Stoner certainly had a tyre advantage so before you cry foul you should think about that too. Stoner wasnt the only one on Bridgies but they were designed primarily for Ducati since the 990 days & his were a lot harder than the others, funnily enough thats exactly how Rossi liked his.


I bet most of the grid would have loved Michelin overnight specials too but did they get them? Can't have it both ways.



Debate & agreeing to disagree is fine. The fool or liar business just wasn't necessary.

Of course Stoner had a tyre advantage in 07. Bridgestone was the better tyre in 2007. No argument. However there was more than a tyre issue with the Fiat Yamaha team in 07. Please read my post carefully before passing judgement.

I never said Vale changed mid season. I did say Pedrosa did by using Puig's influence.

What I did say is that both Vale & Pedrosa switched tyre manufacturers without their factory team doing so.



What I then ask you is, if say Stoner or even Hayden or Spies would be able to have the influence to swap tyre suppliers without their team doing so? I think not.

Is that not an advantage in itself that some riders have & some do not? I think the answer is obvious.

This of course irrelevant in 2010 because of the one tyre supplier.
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November 25th, 2010, 04:58 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by Frizzle View Post
I bet most of the grid would have loved Michelin overnight specials too but did they get them? Can't have it both ways.



Debate & agreeing to disagree is fine. The fool or liar business just wasn't necessary.

Of course Stoner had a tyre advantage in 07. Bridgestone was the better tyre in 2007. No argument. However there was more than a tyre issue with the Fiat Yamaha team in 07. Please read my post carefully before passing judgement.

I never said Vale changed mid season. I did say Pedrosa did by using Puig's influence.

What I did say is that both Vale & Pedrosa switched tyre manufacturers without their factory team doing so.



What I then ask you is, if say Stoner or even Hayden or Spies would be able to have the influence to swap tyre suppliers without their team doing so? I think not.

Is that not an advantage in itself that some riders have & some do not?
I think the answer is obvious.

This of course irrelevant in 2010 because of the one tyre supplier.


Don't you think Frizzle that Vale has earned this advantage through years of hardwork and excellent sucess rate? He wasn't born with that kind advantage did he!!!
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November 25th, 2010, 05:04 PM   #74
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Don't you think Frizzle that Vale has earned this advantage through years of hardwork and excellent sucess rate? He wasn't born with that kind advantage did he!!!


No Inam - I think the rules should be the same for everybody.

Yes he is the goat & yes he generates massive interest in the sport, god knows the sport is much better off because of him.

But the rules must apply to everyone equally or at least they should.
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November 25th, 2010, 05:13 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by Frizzle View Post
No Inam - I think the rules should be the same for everybody.

Yes he is the goat & yes he generates massive interest in the sport, god knows the sport is much better off because of him.

But the rules must apply to everyone equally or at least they should.




But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.
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November 25th, 2010, 05:19 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by johnnyvvc View Post
Stoner certainly had a tyre advantage so before you cry foul you should think about that too. Stoner wasnt the only one on Bridgies but they were designed primarily for Ducati since the 990 days & his were a lot harder than the others, funnily enough thats exactly how Rossi liked his.
There were still several tracks where michelin were superior in 2007, and their qualifiers were always superior.



I wouldn't argue against the bridgestone hard tyres when on casey's bike giving him an advantage on many tracks, but only for him as the other bridgestone riders didn't or couldn't use them to advantage; it was theorized that only he could get them up to operating temperature. I can't see that there was any unfairness involved though.



I personally have never said the michelin tyre situation was unfair either; it was just part of the way of things, and certainly not instigated by rossi or on his behalf. However a tyre company charging some teams and not others for tyres (particularly since the teams charged were usually the less well resourced teams), and providing sns tyres to some of their riders/teams and not others is arguably closer to being unfair than a then second tier team and a then second tier tyre company getting together and working very hard over several years to develop a superior tyre.
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November 25th, 2010, 05:27 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inam View Post
But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.


Of course he didn't break any rules & neither did Pedrosa. Tyre contracts were a team decision not each individual rider.

But what I'm saying is the governing body would not have used their influence for any of the other riders in 2007

Ezpeleta spoke to Bridgestone themselves after Bridgestone did not wish to supply anyone else. Would he have done that for Randy De puniet? I'm sure he would have loved Bridgestones as well? Not a chance.
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November 25th, 2010, 08:01 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frizzle View Post
Of course he didn't break any rules & neither did Pedrosa. Tyre contracts were a team decision not each individual rider.

But what I'm saying is the governing body would not have used their influence for any of the other riders in 2007

Ezpeleta spoke to Bridgestone themselves after Bridgestone did not wish to supply anyone else. Would he have done that for Randy De puniet? I'm sure he would have loved Bridgestones as well? Not a chance.
Your pissing in the wind my friend, they will NEVER NEVER see the inequities when it comes to Rossi. Their only defense is, he earned it.
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November 25th, 2010, 08:19 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by inam View Post
But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.


I thought he terminated the original contract early? Where are yiu getting this "contract was up" stuff?
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November 25th, 2010, 08:42 PM   #80
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I thought he terminated the original contract early? Where are yiu getting this "contract was up" stuff?


Have you get any links where its says he terminated his contract early.
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