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-   -   Remy Gardner (http://motogpforum.com/moto2/24999-remy-gardner.html)

Keshav March 31st, 2019 10:11 AM

Remy Gardner
 
This kid is really exciting. A much more aggressive character than his dad. Canít wait to see more of him.

Theo March 31st, 2019 03:07 PM

Yes he is, but some of his antics are very chancy.
I was pleased to see Fenati came nowhere, wonder if any other riders are bitching about him?

RCV600RR March 31st, 2019 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460109)
This kid is really exciting. A much more aggressive character than his dad. Canít wait to see more of him.

His Dad was a pretty aggressive character in his prime. Grumpy bloke.

michaelm April 1st, 2019 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theo (Post 460124)
Yes he is, but some of his antics are very chancy.
I was pleased to see Fenati came nowhere, wonder if any other riders are bitching about him?

His dad basically had to be crazy to ride the brutal HRC 500 of his day the way he did. Lawson and Erv Kanemoto somewhat tamed the thing, with which Eddie’s All time great skill as a rider doubtless helped, Mick Doohan with advice from Eddie eventually managed to do so while still being maimed by the thing, Wayne just rode the bucking bronco. I can remember him having a massive tank slapper, somehow staying on the bike, then continuing as though nothing had happened.

Keshav April 1st, 2019 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theo (Post 460124)
Yes he is, but some of his antics are very chancy.
I was pleased to see Fenati came nowhere, wonder if any other riders are bitching about him?

Chancy - but fair. I've yet to hear of any riders filing complaints against him. He won't be able to get away with that stuff (at least not so often) when he moves up to MotoGp. I think he'll quickly surpass Miller who seems a bit of a dunce.

Theo April 1st, 2019 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460149)
Chancy - but fair. I've yet to hear of any riders filing complaints against him. He won't be able to get away with that stuff (at least not so often) when he moves up to MotoGp. I think he'll quickly surpass Miller who seems a bit of a dunce.

Yeah I think he'll outshine Miller, but Millers problem was being promoted to early and forced onto a crap bike.
When you look at the gear manufacturers are giving the satellite teams now, would Miller be the same?

michaelm April 1st, 2019 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theo (Post 460151)
Yeah I think he'll outshine Miller, but Millers problem was being promoted to early and forced onto a crap bike.
When you look at the gear manufacturers are giving the satellite teams now, would Miller be the same?

Seems to be pretty fast on an actual Ducati factory bike, faster than their 2nd factory rider all of the most recent race weekend anyway. He was fast at Qatar as well, and I doubt his intellect or lack thereof had much to do with his seat coming loose early in that race. He also has won 1 more motogp race than many, admittedly a wet race, but Dovi similarly had only one win in a wet race for longer than the first few years of his premier class career on much better equipment.

In retrospect he would have been better spending time in moto 2 given how poor the second string Honda satellite bikes were during his tenure as a Honda motogp rider.

Goonwriter April 1st, 2019 04:44 PM

lol, i must have slipped of to a parallel universe where Wayne wasn't an aggressive rider and Jack is a dunce.

Keshav April 1st, 2019 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goonwriter (Post 460158)
lol, i must have slipped of to a parallel universe where Wayne wasn't an aggressive rider and Jack is a dunce.

Gardiner Sr. was very competitive - but he wasn't trading paint every other lap.

As far as Miller's concerned - I stand by my call. The guy is dumb as a box of rocks.

Gaz April 1st, 2019 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460159)
Gardiner Sr. was very competitive - but he wasn't trading paint every other lap.

As far as Miller's concerned - I stand by my call. The guy is dumb as a box of rocks.


Hmm, Jack is dumb and you talk of a different Gardner ............... :p

Dunce or not, Jack has not had a full factory ride yet has more race wins than many in the top class.

Let us not forget that he got his first win before Crutchlow, Vinales and others riding far better equipment.

Plus of course, dunce or not, he is making the money and living the dream that us armchair legends (of our own mind) can only dream

As for Wayne Gardner Not trading paint, well he was super aggressive in his day and would not have thought twice of running a rider out to the line. Fierce, tough and brutal are all words that could describe him .............................. or as a friend of mine who knows him personally constantly says 'Wayne is the biggest toughest prick to ever race in Australia, cars or bikes' .

evo9 April 2nd, 2019 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theo (Post 460124)
Yes he is, but some of his antics are very chancy.
I was pleased to see Fenati came nowhere, wonder if any other riders are bitching about him?


No where as bad as those two bothers from South Africa

Keshav April 2nd, 2019 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaz (Post 460160)
Hmm, Jack is dumb and you talk of a different Gardner ............... :p

Dunce or not, Jack has not had a full factory ride yet has more race wins than many in the top class.

Let us not forget that he got his first win before Crutchlow, Vinales and others riding far better equipment.

Plus of course, dunce or not, he is making the money and living the dream that us armchair legends (of our own mind) can only dream

As for Wayne Gardner Not trading paint, well he was super aggressive in his day and would not have thought twice of running a rider out to the line. Fierce, tough and brutal are all words that could describe him .............................. or as a friend of mine who knows him personally constantly says 'Wayne is the biggest toughest prick to ever race in Australia, cars or bikes' .

To be sure - a rider can be less than brilliant and still be competitive. One much loved American rider we all liked was a terrific racer - but off the track - dumb as a bag of hammers.

Memories of races 40 years in the past will differ. I watched Remy racing last week and he was elbowing riders left and right and I recall his dad - competitive but much cleaner in his passes. In terms of being an outright hard-headed dick - he's not a patch on Doohan.

Theo April 2nd, 2019 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evo9 (Post 460166)
No where as bad as those two bothers from South Africa

I presume you are referring to the Binder brothers. Hmm I don't think they bash around that much, but Daren certainly is more legs and arms of the 2. Nor do they go for grabbing someones brake lever.

michaelm April 2nd, 2019 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460179)
To be sure - a rider can be less than brilliant and still be competitive. One much loved American rider we all liked was a terrific racer - but off the track - dumb as a bag of hammers.

Memories of races 40 years in the past will differ. I watched Remy racing last week and he was elbowing riders left and right and I recall his dad - competitive but much cleaner in his passes. In terms of being an outright hard-headed dick - he's not a patch on Doohan.

I do remember those races fairly well and Wayne was no stranger to swapping paint, although did not elbow people that I recall. He came from superbikes and never competed in the 250 or 125 championships, and the bikes in those classes were not uniform then anyway, but use of the elbows is fairly mandatory if you are to compete in moto2 or moto3 these days with packed fields and supposedly equal bikes.

Mick was Wayneís superior as a rider and particularly at development and set up and one of the hardest bastards who ever lived, but mostly passed fairly cleanly himself unless peeved with Alex Criville and desirous of making a point to him.

evo9 April 2nd, 2019 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theo (Post 460185)
I presume you are referring to the Binder brothers. Hmm I don't think they bash around that much, but Daren certainly is more legs and arms of the 2. Nor do they go for grabbing someones brake lever.

Yes them! They don't bash, they just ram or barge into other riders.

Keshav April 3rd, 2019 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelm (Post 460190)
I do remember those races fairly well and Wayne was no stranger to swapping paint, although did not elbow people that I recall. He came from superbikes and never competed in the 250 or 125 championships, and the bikes in those classes were not uniform then anyway, but use of the elbows is fairly mandatory if you are to compete in moto2 or moto3 these days with packed fields and supposedly equal bikes.

Mick was Wayneís superior as a rider and particularly at development and set up and one of the hardest bastards who ever lived, but mostly passed fairly cleanly himself unless peeved with Alex Criville and desirous of making a point to him.

I think there may be a bit lost in translation due to differing understanding of analgous words/expressions. Elbowing was not meant to imply that Remy was literally jabbing riders in the chest to throw off their rhythm. I enjoy watching him and was not put off by how physical he is when passing. Very entertaining really. Certainly - nobody complained of "rough riding"; at least not so far.

Regarding equality of Moto 2 bikes - I never assume that. Clearly some chassis and fairing manufacturers are superior and some team techs are bound to think outside the box and come up with legal tricks to offer small advantages.

michaelm April 3rd, 2019 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460198)
I think there may be a bit lost in translation due to differing understanding of analgous words/expressions. Elbowing was not meant to imply that Remy was literally jabbing riders in the chest to throw off their rhythm. I enjoy watching him and was not put off by how physical he is when passing. Very entertaining really. Certainly - nobody complained of "rough riding"; at least not so far.

Regarding equality of Moto 2 bikes - I never assume that. Clearly some chassis and fairing manufacturers are superior and some team techs are bound to think outside the box and come up with legal tricks to offer small advantages.

I agree, and meant to imply that I donít think the bikes are equal in moto 2 now, but there are a lot of them and they are closer together than the golden era 500s when the now legendary riders had imo the greatest stoushes ever on bikes that required rather substantial rider input, but there were marked performance differences in the field generally.

Keshav April 3rd, 2019 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelm (Post 460200)
I agree, and meant to imply that I donít think the bikes are equal in moto 2 now, but there are a lot of them and they are closer together than the golden era 500s when the now legendary riders had imo the greatest stoushes ever on bikes that required rather substantial rider input, but there were marked performance differences in the field generally.

Yep - that differential sure as hell accounts for why Sheene and Schwantz were so heralded. The Suzukis were really deficient compared to the Hondas and Yamahas. Watching the wild shapes Schwantz made on that bike was really something. It was like gravity had gone insane in his little sphere of existence.

ratdeal April 4th, 2019 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460201)
It was like gravity had gone insane in his little sphere of existence.

I'm stealing this. Great description of any rider/bike on the edge of control.

Theo April 4th, 2019 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evo9 (Post 460191)
Yes them! They don't bash, they just ram or barge into other riders.

As someone pointed out, in moto 2 and 3 they all do that now the field is so packed its inevitable. I've even noticed McPhee is getting his elbows involved and hes a nice guy lol.

michaelm April 4th, 2019 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460201)
Yep - that differential sure as hell accounts for why Sheene and Schwantz were so heralded. The Suzukis were really deficient compared to the Hondas and Yamahas. Watching the wild shapes Schwantz made on that bike was really something. It was like gravity had gone insane in his little sphere of existence.

Even more so the non factory bikes, which people forget not uncommonly were lapped even without crashing.

Keshav April 5th, 2019 05:37 AM

That's funny. I hadn't thought about that; the privateers being regularly lapped, and yet - many of those guys were still highly regarded by the fans. There seems to have been a great shift in the value of fans in that there doesn't seem to be as many that root for the underdog.

michaelm April 8th, 2019 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keshav (Post 460240)
That's funny. I hadn't thought about that; the privateers being regularly lapped, and yet - many of those guys were still highly regarded by the fans. There seems to have been a great shift in the value of fans in that there doesn't seem to be as many that root for the underdog.

Garry Mc Coy actually winning premier class GP races on a bike that was basically brought to the race week-end in the boot of a car was what was really impressive to me, making some allowance for my obvious national allegiance.

Barbedwirebikerr April 8th, 2019 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelm (Post 460274)
Garry Mc Coy actually winning premier class GP races on a bike that was basically brought to the race week-end in the boot of a car was what was really impressive.

Fixed. No allegiances required. It was stand alone impressive.

Barbedwirebikerr April 14th, 2019 06:54 AM

I missed qp for moto2. What happened to Remy? He's last on the grid. Did he crash and not complete a lap? Was he just slow?

Theo April 14th, 2019 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbedwirebikerr (Post 460320)
I missed qp for moto2. What happened to Remy? He's last on the grid. Did he crash and not complete a lap? Was he just slow?

I'll tell you if you really want to know. But he started 18th.

Keshav April 14th, 2019 01:53 PM

But he did a great job of damage control. I think he's got "it".

Havey June 20th, 2021 08:56 PM

Any body notice Remy done three in a row, more to come.:)

p4p1 June 20th, 2021 09:55 PM

It's been interesting so far, I think many of us thought he was living off of his last name and to degree I am sure he was. IIRC there was implications of his garage etc being able to get away with some stuff they shouldn't have been able to before he was in the paddock based on his last name.

The excuses for his poor moto3 results didn't seem valid, and up until last year it looked as if he was destined to be a never was with a famous father. Then he turned things around completely and as an Aussie I couldn't be much happier.

michaelm June 20th, 2021 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p4p1 (Post 466212)
It's been interesting so far, I think many of us thought he was living off of his last name and to degree I am sure he was. IIRC there was implications of his garage etc being able to get away with some stuff they shouldn't have been able to before he was in the paddock based on his last name.

The excuses for his poor moto3 results didn't seem valid, and up until last year it looked as if he was destined to be a never was with a famous father. Then he turned things around completely and as an Aussie I couldn't be much happier.

Same for me. I am pleasantly surprised at how he looks his year, and am hopeful for the future given his consistency, apparent ability to push things without crashing and overtaking prowess, particularly as a large lad by gp bike racing standards, which should be less of a factor in the premier class. Coming through as he has (there was talk he was offered a premier class ride earlier in his career) is probably a good thing as well, as opposed to the likes of Lecuona who might be one and done after being tossed straight into the premier class much younger.

Perhaps his earlier unimpressiveness was at least partly equipment or team related, I don't think Dad Wayne was convinced some of the earlier choices made by him and his manager were necessarily the best ones going by an interview I saw.

p4p1 June 20th, 2021 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelm (Post 466215)
Same for me. I am pleasantly surprised at how he looks his year, and am hopeful for the future given his consistency, apparent ability to push things without crashing and overtaking prowess, particularly as a large lad by gp bike racing standards, which should be less of a factor in the premier class. Coming through as he has (there was talk he was offered a premier class ride earlier in his career) is probably a good thing as well, as opposed to the likes of Lecuona who might be one and done after being tossed straight into the premier class much younger.

Perhaps his earlier unimpressiveness was at least partly equipment or team related, I don't think Dad Wayne was convinced some of the earlier choices made by him and his manager were necessarily the best ones going by an interview I saw.

Interesting. I always figured that his dad had final say more or less/would be the confidant whom Remy would make his decisions with. But perhaps Wayne was happy to let Remy make his own decisions/mistakes which would also not surprise me either as he does come across as the kind of guy who will let you make your own mistakes believing that's a better way to learn than just being told not to.
Not to mention a lot of father son relationships can fall apart when the father is playing the managerial role as well which is something both of them may not have wanted to chance either.

33 Coupe June 21st, 2021 01:08 AM

I too, was unconvinced of Remy's talent earlier on. But, last year i thought he started to show something on the bike and seemed to mature quite a bit. He was getting reasonable results, better than the bike should be capable of, and kept his head down and focused on the job. Other teams took note, he ended up on a good team and now he is really making the most of the opportunity. Can't wait to see him on the big boy bikes next year.

On another note, Oli Baylis, WOW. Won his first race in the Aussie Superbike championship yesterday. Man, for someone so young (17), I am really impressed how he can jump on a superbike and ring its neck the way he does. There wouldn't be too many his age that can jump on a Ducati Panigale and ride the way he did, powersliding out of turns at full tilt. A real chip off the old block, so to speak. I can see Ducati giving him a run on a Moto GP bike real soon.

Might be another golden age for Aussie's with these 2 in the future.

michaelm June 21st, 2021 01:52 AM

Double

michaelm June 21st, 2021 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p4p1 (Post 466217)
Interesting. I always figured that his dad had final say more or less/would be the confidant whom Remy would make his decisions with. But perhaps Wayne was happy to let Remy make his own decisions/mistakes which would also not surprise me either as he does come across as the kind of guy who will let you make your own mistakes believing that's a better way to learn than just being told not to.
Not to mention a lot of father son relationships can fall apart when the father is playing the managerial role as well which is something both of them may not have wanted to chance either.

Yes I was a big Wayne Gardner fan back in the day, but became less enamoured of him in his early retirement when he came across as something of a wanker and envious of Mick Doohan’s even greater success.

I am warming to him again now he is more invested in Remy to whom while proud and supportive he seems to have exactly the right attitude rather than being one of those fathers trying to re-live his own glory days, or to have vicarious glory days through their children, although as opposed to most in that category he obviously did have his own quite considerable days of glory on a world stage.

33 Coupe June 21st, 2021 02:02 AM

One more to keep an eye on, though on 4 wheels this time rather than 2. Mick Doohans boy, Jack, has just won his first F3 race and is looking to head to F1. He has signed up to Red Bulls junior drivers program, so I guess he is on the best path to F1, with RB backing you. They say the apple never falls far from the tree, and it really seems true in the case of the Gardner, Baylis and Doohan clans.

michaelm June 21st, 2021 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33 Coupe (Post 466219)
I too, was unconvinced of Remy's talent earlier on. But, last year i thought he started to show something on the bike and seemed to mature quite a bit. He was getting reasonable results, better than the bike should be capable of, and kept his head down and focused on the job. Other teams took note, he ended up on a good team and now he is really making the most of the opportunity. Can't wait to see him on the big boy bikes next year.

On another note, Oli Baylis, WOW. Won his first race in the Aussie Superbike championship yesterday. Man, for someone so young (17), I am really impressed how he can jump on a superbike and ring its neck the way he does. There wouldn't be too many his age that can jump on a Ducati Panigale and ride the way he did, powersliding out of turns at full tilt. A real chip off the old block, so to speak. I can see Ducati giving him a run on a Moto GP bike real soon.

Might be another golden age for Aussie's with these 2 in the future.

Son of a gun.

Arrabbiata1 August 30th, 2021 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelm (Post 466222)
Yes I was a big Wayne Gardner fan back in the day, but became less enamoured of him in his early retirement when he came across as something of a wanker and envious of Mick Doohanís even greater success.

I am warming to him again now he is more invested in Remy to whom while proud and supportive he seems to have exactly the right attitude rather than being one of those fathers trying to re-live his own glory days, or to have vicarious glory days through their children, although as opposed to most in that category he obviously did have his own quite considerable days of glory on a world stage.

Loved Digger in his day. Always struck me as a difficult individual - and suspect that his presence in the paddock had a negative effect of Remy, particularly given their fractious relationship in the past. He hadn't managed to get to races throughout the covid crisis, and when he eventually rematerialised at Spielberg this month, the resultant 4th and 7th made me fear the worst. Don't think he was at Silverstone this weekend was he?

michaelm August 30th, 2021 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arrabbiata1 (Post 466942)
Loved Digger in his day. Always struck me as a difficult individual - and suspect that his presence in the paddock had a negative effect of Remy, particularly given their fractious relationship in the past. He hadn't managed to get to races throughout the covid crisis, and when he eventually rematerialised at Spielberg this month, the resultant 4th and 7th made me fear the worst. Don't think he was at Silverstone this weekend was he?

Maybe so, didnít know he was at Spielberg. But I donít mark Remy down for the 7th, apart from not doing better in qualifying perhaps, he got shuffled back at the start and took the most points available for him rather than throwing it down the road like Raul Fernandez did, although Fernandez while obviously a great talent is a rookie and apparently hadnít ridden at Silverstone before. I think Remy who I didnít have great hopes for when he was younger seems to have developed well and is showing a fair amount of composure, and as has been said might be suited by the premier class given his size.

Good to see you posting btw. Still greatly regret never making it to a Grand Prix weekend with you guys.

Gaz August 30th, 2021 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arrabbiata1 (Post 466942)
Loved Digger in his day. Always struck me as a difficult individual - and suspect that his presence in the paddock had a negative effect of Remy, particularly given their fractious relationship in the past. He hadn't managed to get to races throughout the covid crisis, and when he eventually rematerialised at Spielberg this month, the resultant 4th and 7th made me fear the worst. Don't think he was at Silverstone this weekend was he?


Have not had a lot of dealings with him, only a small number both at tracks and at other places.

He has mellowed, heaps.

I did fear that he was living through Remy for a number of years, much like the 'bad parent' that pushes their child to achieve and what not, the one that screams at officials or the coach if their kid is not good enough.

What I have seen (and heard - a mate of mine is in near weekly touch with him) is that he has mellowed and is settling down a fair bit.

In may mate's words, it just took him longer to lose the competitive instincts and accept retirement


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